killuridols

1 minute ago, Tori72 said:

Thank you! Fantastic, they were so in sync and on point. Also the whole vibe, the size of the venue, bassist barefoot and those „Go Go“ dancers rocking out, being dudes and wearing slacky clothes. I cannot not thing of Axl’s and Izzy’s stripper friends dancing in bikinis/underwear ... Do you think Nirvana were thinking about that? Maybe they were already taking the piss of GnR?

Hahaha, yeah the male dancers and their t-shirts ARE THE SHIT!!!

Hmm, not sure this was a dig at GN'R. I think this is who Nirvana genuinely were and that's the very same reason why Kurt didn't like Axl and didn't want to meet him and Axl could not understand any of this because he was clueless.

Looking back in restrospect, I guess not many people understood what was going on or what it was Nirvana's message. Some people just thought they were doing these things to provoke, that it was an acting. Watching it again makes me see stuff I had not taken into consideration before. Back then, I liked Nirvana, I bought their "Nevermind" and I was listening to GN'R as well.... though I was kid too so I was not much aware of certain things, feminism, sexism, but I did like these aesthetics more than GN'R.

For a whole year (from 1993-1994) I dressed like Kurt, had a haircut like that and wore Nirvana t-shirt. Kids from my school thought I was crazy and dirty. Those kids were uptight and did not listen to rock or grunge or nothing of the sort. However, I was one with good grades and while I was not "popular", I was not bullied either. LOL.

1 hour ago, Tori72 said:

I listened to their songs today as well. Haven’t done so in a while. What a great and gritty band they were. Great songs, great lyrics. I wished we could know what Kurt would have done, for music, and rock, if he stayed alive.

I once found this video on YouTube and I couldn't believe my eyes how fucking great it is!!

The band, the aesthetics, the vibe, everything's so perfect...... makes me miss the 90's and at the same time it feels like all of it happened yesterday

Nirvana - Drain You (Live at the Paramount 1991) Seattle - October 31, 1991. Source Bluray 720p.

It's a whole show, btw.

21 minutes ago, vikute91 said:

I brought up Courtney's heroin use during pregnancy to show that there were in fact substantial grounds (not only for Axl but for everyone) to predict less than fortunate outcomes.

Oh but didn't Axl want to desperately be Kurt's friend? Around that time he didn't give a fuck about Kurt being a "junkie" or his wife or his baby, right?

Axl's concern for Frances Bean was bullshit and that was my initial point. He only wanted to shame them and damage them, just like he wanted to make Dylan turn against his mother. 

25 minutes ago, vikute91 said:

Now to the Courtney/Axl altercation at the VMAs. It's not like he came to insult her out of the blue. According to witnesses, the tone in which she spoke to him was clearly meant to taunt and mock him. The role of a conflict instigator shouldn't be downplayed. If you want to be treated like a decent person - act like one.

You can always be the better person and just ignore the mocking.

Courtney's joke wasn't deserving of such disproportionate response. That's where the difference is and in the end, Kurt won, because he saved the situation by turning it into a comical thing. People laughed at how ridiculous Axl looked, insulting a family with such violence.

Kurt Cobain: These were his words: “You shut your bitch up, or I’m taking you down to the pavement.” [laughs] So I turned to Courtney and said: “Shut up, bitch!” So I guess I did what he wanted me to do – be a man.

Amy Finnerty: Kurt’s tone was very sarcastic, so everybody laughed… at Axl basically, for making such a comment about a woman… especially because anybody who knew Kurt and Courtney knew that a) Kurt wasn’t that type of person and b)nobody could ever keep Courtney in line, so what was he thinking? I’d say Kurt handled that situation perfectly. He knew exactly what he was doing by turning to Courtney and saying that. It really lessened the tension in the room, allowed the rest of us to laugh a little bit. Then [Axl’s then girlfriend] Stephanie Seymour asked Courtney: “Are you a model?” and Courtney replied: “No. Are you a brain surgeon?” Axl didn’t seem to know how to respond, so he walked off. I leaned over to Kurt and said: “Wow, that was weird!” And he said: “I was really scared.” He wasn’t kidding. It was, like, scared of being beat up.

Tabitha Soren: Shortly afterwards, I walked through the backstage area. I saw a bunch of very large, muscular bodyguards in all-black T-shirts restraining Axl Rose. His girlfriend was looking very shaken, but at that moment, I didn’t even know who he had had an altercation with.

Kurt Loder: It was like two worlds colliding. That was sort of an important moment in the way fashions changed, and you really saw the culture of music going in a slightly different way.

36 minutes ago, Lio said:

And I said it wasn't true, addicted babies are born everyday, pregnant women doing hard drugs do get babies that survive.

It's not far-fetched to say that fetuses receiving drugs, alcohol, etc. could be born dead or with severe health problems. I guess the overall point is that doing drugs during pregnancy is wrong. But at the same time, it doesn't look to me that Frances Bean was a baby with that kind of problems. I remember her from pictures of 1992 that she was a chubby smiling baby.

43 minutes ago, Lio said:

I haven't mentioned Axl at all. I was merely stating what you said (that quote), was untrue.

And I never asked for sympathy for Courtney regarding her drug addiction. So when you respond that you feel no sorry for her behavior as a mother, you are just joining the derailment of my initial point, which was that Axl verbally abused Courtney during the VMA's.

Then someone else brought up the drug shit, as if that was a valid reason to have Courtney humiliated in front of everybody, especially when she was holding that baby Axl was so "concerned" about.

2 hours ago, Len Cnut said:

Who gives a flying shit, if people are dumb enough to buy em then why not?  And y'know, we of all people should not be so fucking judgemental.  I mean look at it this way, alright, whats wrong about this?  That its their love letters, their relationship, this personal private thing that belongs only to them thats supposed to have some sort of unique connection to them?  Well what does that say about the sorts of fans that populate forums such as this one that wouldn't fuckin' bat a fuckin' eyelid at the oppertunity to read one of those fuckers?  And I'm not better, shit, I'm a Kurt Cobain fan that went out and bought his fuckin' diaries when they were published

Exactly 

Here people discuss relationships of their idols on a daily basis. Everybody judge on Perla, Erin, Stephanie, Susan, Meeghan, etc.... fans never refuse to read the gossip and even follow them on their social media, but all of a sudden a love letter is an evil thing?  

Or is it because they are selling this stuff? Because last time I checked, all the news and gossip we consume about this band is also being sold to us and we pay for it without blinking, lol.

3 hours ago, Lio said:

This is simply not true. Addicted babies are born every day, sadly.

I have no sympathy at all for any mother with no regard of her baby's well-being and health. It's not only despicable, it's criminal too.

Was Frances Bean born an addicted baby? 

I never said I had sympathy for Courtney regarding her dangerous behavior but I don't see how that gives a green light to this man Axl to verbally abuse her during the VMA's.

I'm sure Slash has agreed to have all that shit auctioned to his Fans... I don't think he is a fool or that Perla is doing this out of spite and he doesn't know anything. 

Come on, Slash is smarter than all of us together. 

1 hour ago, vikute91 said:

Most likely it was merely luck rather than her using drugs in moderation. Forget about heroin. Do I really need to tell you that even smoking and drinking during pregnancy can have sad consequences on child's health?

No, you dont have to tell me anything because I know very well and I'm not condoning it. Of course, it is wrong and should not be encouraged nor applauded. But I don't think Courtney was trying to hurt her baby on purpose and I dont think she was "lucky" with it. There's no luck in that kind of thing. If she was doing hard drugs during the pregnancy, we wouldn't have Frances with us today. So, maybe there's a lot of ill-intentions involved, though I'm not saying she was a saint either.

My point is that I don't believe Axl was genuinely worried about Frances Bean or Dylan. If he had been for real, he wouldn't have disrespected Courtney at the VMA's and he could have acted differently, like the "caring" person some fans say he is, he could have come close to the couple and congratulate them on the baby, check up the baby was fine and be the better man. But no, all of a sudden, he decided to take a silly joke the wrong way and insult all of them.... Why? 

1 hour ago, vikute91 said:

However, if I knew that my own mother risked my well-being or even my life for a hit, that would hurt way more than a man beating me.  

Good Lord I'm not stealing this level of zealotry....

10 minutes ago, vikute91 said:

 You would blame Brexit on Axl if you could, I believe

And yes, Courtney herself has admitted to it. Would you think differently of her if Frances hadn't come out all fine?

No, what I say about Axl is based on publicly known information. I don't make shit up. Ever.

As for Courtney, it seems she didn't do that much of the drug, otherwise the baby would have been born really bad or even dead. And that's not the case. So maybe she's not the perfect mother, but she wasn't as bad as to let herself go nuts on drugs and damage the baby.

4 minutes ago, Gordon Comstock said:

For small-town white boys....

Just trying to make ends meet.... 

23 hours ago, Gordon Comstock said:

One In A Million

Cornshucker

Used To Love Her

Back Off Bitch

Anything Goes

I Don't Care About You

Pretty Tied Up

My World

Silkworms

One In A Million (reprise)

Fabulous setlist for an ALT RIGHT event 

47 minutes ago, vikute91 said:

Thank goodness that Frances Bean Cobain turned out ok, but it could have easily been the other way. Women who shoot heroin while pregnant or do drugs in front of kids must be called out. And wasn't it Courtney's exemplary motherhood that had Frances file a restraining order against her mother for some time?

Is it proven that she was shooting heroin while pregnant? Or was it just a rumor spreaded by jealous Axl? As far as I know, the baby was born pretty fine 

I never said Courtney was an exemplary mother, but Frances is an amazing kid. And I don't follow their lives that much, I just know that mothers and daughters sometimes have disagreements and they fight, but it looks to me that Frances and Courtney are pretty much on good terms nowadays. Frances participated of the documentary Montage of Heck, along with her mother, so.... It's all fine, it seems.

53 minutes ago, vikute91 said:

Now, everybody makes mistakes and, I believe, is entitled to some benefit of a doubt or a second chance, but it's funny to me how you condemn one person in whose 'shoes you haven't been in and have no idea what he was dealing with', yet ask for sympathy towards another. 

Who do I condemn? AXL? For being a wifebeater, mysoginist, piece of shit abuser?

Oh yeah, I have no sympathy for people like that. Having had a tough life is no excuse for doing the shit he did to others.

Fuck him and fuck his sorry ass excuses.

LOL why not? 

It's their relationship, not ours... so why get so upset at what they do? 

All these people live their lives in the public eye. And that's how they choose to live their breakups as well.

Love letters have gone public since ancient times.... you can find a love letter from almost any famous or renown person. Same with personal items and other stuff. I guess auctions are a business and they exist because there is demand.

It's funny how they paint Axl as someone who cared about children that were not his own , but all he did was humiliate the mothers of those children, probably just out of jealousy and contempt for their motherhood.

Turns out that Dylan is a healthy young man and Frances Bean Cobain is a beautiful and talented young woman nowadays. They didn't grow up to be shit, like spiteful Axl predicted in the past. I'm happy for those kids and how they turned out, especially Frances Bean. I follow her on IG, she's amazing. 

And let's not condemn Kurt for his decision. None of us was in his shoes and we have no idea what he was dealing with.

Just like with the abortion subject, I believe in quality of life, not having a life just becuase you have to be born or have to live it. If your life is shit, then you're better off without it.

With this, I'm not glamorizing suicide or encouraging it. Do not take it the wrong way. What I'm saying is that people make choices in life and they are personal. We should not be comparing the life of one to the other, because circumstances are different for each person.

Our lives are fragile and they can be taken away anytime, either by ourselves, others or naturally.

5 minutes ago, vikute91 said:

Regarding Dave Grohl, I wasn't really alluding to any specific grudges or friendships with Axl, I was speaking more generally. What I tried to say was Nirvana's Dave Grohl in my eyes is too different from Dave Grohl in Foo Fighters. I bet Nirvana would hate Foo Fighters. The whole anti-establishment outlook they had back in the day...Did he just change that much or was it a persona he was putting on? 

Well, I have no idea. I've never followed Grohl that closely as to make a judgement like that.

To me, he's the same guy, just older and in a different band because... yeah, years pass by, life goes on, people get older and some people change.... I don't see how Foo Fighters is so bad. They do have commercial success but why is it a bad thing, Im not sure why Nirvana would hate Foo Fighters.... Maybe, but Nirvana was Nirvana and this an older Grohl, a different person than Kurt.

Not sure what should he be doing? Living under a bridge? LOL

8 minutes ago, Tori72 said:

Coudln’t agree more. Kurt was open minded, tolerant and all in for equal rights for homosexuals, women and especially he talked against this macho-lonesome wolf-hurting inside-being brutal outside-kind of rock n roll man.

Exactly

Besides...... this situation: Kurt is sitting with his wife and baby, somewhere at the VMA'S backstage, Courtney throws an innocent joke at Axl and there Axl comes back and insults her. Actually, ignores her and tells her husband what to do with "his bitch"........ Seriously, why would anyone tolerate such violence from a fucking asshole to their wife, who is also holding a baby??? A BABY!!!!

Had I been Kurt, I would have broke all of Axl's teeth and bones..... I mean... what the fuck?? ....... how could Axl be so violent in public towards a woman tells how much shitty those years were, no one told him fucking shit. Wish it had been now, let's see if he would have gotten away with it!

31 minutes ago, vikute91 said:

I don't know if it was an artsy persona that he had put on or if he was actually like that. Dave Grohl, on the other hand, have always come off as playing a part to me. Never came to like the guy. All this animosity towards the established bands during Nirvana years, yet now acting as everybody's best buddy. Hypocrite much? Wonder if Kurt was alive today, would he be on friendly terms with Axl now? Possible 

I think Kurt was genuine and he didn't like Axl because Axl was everything Kurt was preaching against at the time. I don't think it's so hard to understand why Kurt didn't like Axl, and even if they had met, the chance of Kurt liking Axl were minimal, so what for?

As for Dave Grohl, I don't think he is a hypocrite for being on friendly terms with Axl now..... They are both grown up men, a lot of water ran under the bridge, and there's no reason for Dave to hold a grudge for so long, unless he was Axl... lol

Fuck these no-new-music bitches 

45 minutes ago, Graeme said:

I'm not trying to do that, though, and I haven't done that anywhere on this thread, or (to my knowledge) on this forum. I'm not comparing what I experienced in the 00s to what you experienced in the 90s in a statistical sense... You had people queueing up outside stores for hours before the Illusions came out and Guns were the biggest contemporary artists in existence. It was a different world. 

I'm not saying you've done that but you kinda generalized the behavior of the fans of the first hour and I don't think that's the case for all people. That's why I tried to remind you that some people who believe CD is the best GN'R album ever and the 00's lineups are better than the original, well, SOME of those people are also aggressive, not only towards other fans but towards the very same band members that made a huge name of GN'R. 

49 minutes ago, Graeme said:

It doesn't mean in 2006, when the leaks happened, the Trunk interview, the Hammerstein shows, the Rock in Rio and Inland Invasion webcasts, the rumours of the album release, etc. that it wasn't a hugely exciting and fun time for a lot of fans of the band (including some people who had experienced everything you did, like @RussTCB). You've seen more people than me on this thread say that they felt the same. 

I really doubt 2006 was remotely close to 1991 and 1992.

Yeah, it was exciting because Axl was out and about and it all pointed to the idea that he was going to finally release the album (an album some fans had been waiting since 1999 or so). However, the whole shit got dismantled again and the disappointment was even bigger than in the 90s.

Lies and the Illusions were only 2 years apart. Fans knew the band was active, that they were going on a tour, there was an specific release date and people saw evidence of it. We were all happy kids, discovering life and the band.

During those years, the environment wasn't contaminated of bad vibes like in the 00's, when we had already seen the darkest side of original GN'R, with their legal battles, media scandals and the never-ending war of Axl vs. the old line-up.

And the worst part is to know that in 2006, Axl was totally lying to his Fans, because that album wasn't going to come out until late 2008. The rest is sad history.

Just now, lame ass security said:

I don't know if it's boring or just bored.😄 I come on here sometimes just for a bit of friendly debate strictly out of boredom.

I feel ya bro' 

Some of this shit it is pretty entertaining to read.

And I'm one of those poor people who don't have Netflix 

1 hour ago, soon said:

Your eyes just heard (?) a song by an Alanis Morissette super-fan!! He's singing her praises. He made a song dedicated to complimenting her and celebrating her! 

A singing hyena? 

How much of a boring wanker one has to be to analyze AFD, Lies, the Illusions, etc. after analyzing the shit of it during 30 years or so? 

With so many new artists and new music out there, why would we restrict ourselves to listening to GN'R or discussing their stale discography for the zillion time? 

Unless you were born yesterday and just discovered this band, I can't fucking see the point of telling a fan from the first hour to embark themselves into such a miserable task 

5 hours ago, Len Cnut said:

God knows the boy can sing a few different ways, I think you make a really good point here.  But I guess the way its look at its like a commodity and a certain style he did was like, saleable, as he stands he's kinda like trading off a brand and certain thing thats expected of him, in his twilight years its about padding out the pension so it'd be a bit of a risk for him to do something like, y'know, Axls album of French crooning standard, je ne regrette ne rein or Axl Sings Albert Chevaliers Hits   Actually, I'd love to see the last one!

W00t? O_o 

LOL No!  

I didn't mean that he has to change for that kind of singing. I'm talking about a voice similar to "Patience" voice or OIAM, you know, his low register which is actually his natural speaking voice.

But Yeah, I understand that his screechy voice is his trademark and people expect that from him. Not me, though.... I think that kind of voice is cringe in 2019 and that he can't reach those high notes anymore. At least, not in a live show.