Guns N' Roses have new Manager

[pilferk]

Ticketmaster makes its money on every ticket sold with its horseshit "service" and "convenience" charges. So yeah, they would make money on a GNR tour even if it didn't sell well. Some people have to see everything in black and white, when in reality GNR still sells more tickets than the vast majority of acts and even if they were selling 8000 tickets a night for a 30 date tour, Ticketmaster would still take in well over $4,000,000 which no doubt you will say is meaningless, but for a company who posted a net loss of $1.1 billion in 2008, their shareholders and the BOD isn't going to look kindly on a CEO turning away income because of some personal grudge.

You also assume that there's bad blood between the two and they somehow hate each other now just because they didn't see eye to eye on something

Nor would his CFO, who would see it as leaving money on the table...money they really need to be profitable...and money that might save HIS job.

Nor would the SEC, who would see doing so as a violation of his fiduciary duties to his shareholders.

Nor would his subordinates, the ones actually DOING the negotiating with GnR, who would see it as effecting their potential bonuses, the health of the company, and (considering there have been rumors of layoffs) potentially their jobs.

Nor would the Federal Government, who could possibly open up another anti-trust suit based on that type of action, which would further anger the BOD and the shareholders.

There's absolutely NO way any "ill will" with Azoff, even if it existed, would come into play,here. No way. TM has too much to lose, and NOTHING to gain, by allowing it to occur. Azoff would have too much to lose and NOTHING to gain by allowing a stupid personal grudge to have any effect on how he'd run a HUGE corporate entity.

And that ignores the fact that Azoff wouldn't have any direct contact with ANYTHING GnR was doing with TM. They wouldn't be talking to him, at this point, anyway.....and his shareholders would be pissed off if he did, because that's not what he was hired for.

I guess you miss the people giving me shit first, but of course you ignore that part.

You know what I am saying is true but you just want to kiss Axls ass and pretend its not.

Its funny you left that part out.

Or they simply question inane assertions and questions you put forth.

Which, of course, is rather the point of posting ON A DISCUSSION FORUM.

If you just want to hear yourself talk....rather than listen/discuss....what are you doing HERE??!!

And I guess everyone outside this board has met Axl, knows him personally, has hung out with him countless times because it would just be so so silly if they based their viewpoint on him through the blinkered viewpoint of the media.

True words.

Axl likes his privacy. He's not comfortable with the more tabloid elements of celebrity...and because he's not so media friendly (especially since the mid 90's), he tends to get a bad wrap. I suspect there's a lot of misrepresentation and speculation making up a lot of those media articles...because Axl simply doesn't talk about that stuff.

And what on the "inside" might seem pretty logical or normal or apt...from the outside isn't always so.

Look, Axl's no angel. He's eccentric, quirky, and all that...but many creative people are. Most geniuses are (witness Einstein), too. The truth is probably somewhere in the middle (as with most things) and if you look at "the middle".....it's not all that remarkable.

Edited February 19, 2010 by pilferk

[Boazg]

I didn't read any of your 4/5 posts on this page but I can assume they were along the lines of:

Axl is a dick

Beta is a dick

02 band was better

This whole situation is a joke

Everyone on here lacks common sense but me

Nah a few others have common sense, but most people on here cannot accept the truth.

You need to take off your Axl Rose colored glasses.

You claim im nuts blah blah blah, but the funny thing is you make the comments you make about Axl off these boards, and you will get laughed at.

Everyone knows Axl is crazy, a dickhead to most people, does not care about his fans, and his voice is pretty much gone (its not even close to what it was in the 90s let alone 80s like some of you nut jobs believe) , the only people who cannot accept that are a few hundred people on these boards.

Have you been to a show this year?

His voice is definitely at the best it has been since the 90s. The differences between 02, 06, and this year were very noticeable - and I was actually at shows, not talking out of my ass.

Also, Axl has generally been nice to almost anyone he's met fan-wise from what I've read. Never met him myself, so I can't comment beyond that. I'm betting you haven't met him, so perhaps you shouldn't be commenting either. The fact that he rants on the net doesn't make him an asshole. If that was the benchmark, the entire net would be guilty of it.

Just listen to the monitor mix and you will see this voice is shot.

Its getting better but its no where close to being as good as 92 (take the paris show for example). Anyone who claims differently is delusional.

He has no power left in his voice and its very thin sounding.

Plus he has to use backing tracks now, he never did back in the 80s or 90s.

He sounds decent yes, but his voice is 50% of what it once was. I am not saying he sounds like shit, because he doesnt. I am just saying he is not as good as he was in the 80s and 90s like people are claiming on this board.

As for him being nice to people he meets, I am not talking about that.

I am talking about the people he beats up because they have a camera, or he always seems to get in fights at airports, or picking fights with other bands lead singers, stuff like that.

He also disrespects fans for going on so late, no showing gigs and walking off mid set for stupid reasons..

Yes the going on late has been going on since the 90s but that doesnt make it right. Sure gnr fans have accepted it, but again its disrespectful to make fans wait til past 11pm to see him go on stage when the doors open at 6 or 7.

I've just read some of your post including this one and just wondering what the fuck are you doing on this board. Man, something really isn't rigt with you. Go visit some doctors immediately. You have a big problem.

[Zint]

I've just read some of your post including this one and just wondering what the fuck are you doing on this board. Man, something really isn't rigt with you. Go visit some doctors immediately. You have a big problem.

Debate his point of view,but a post that's basically just a personal attack is not cool.

Please keep that in mind.

Edited February 19, 2010 by zint61

[sourdeezl]

WHAT A SUPRISE AXL FIRED ANOTHER MANAGER LOL.

BAZ SHOULD JUST BE THE MANAGER. HE COULD DO A BETTER JOB THAN MOST OF THESE IDIOTS ANYWAY

[karlossacanell]

I've just read some of your post including this one and just wondering what the fuck are you doing on this board. Man, something really isn't rigt with you. Go visit some doctors immediately. You have a big problem.

Debate his point of view,but a post that's basically just a personal attack is not cool.

Please keep that in mind.

Well sone, Mr. Moderator

[realpoti]

People who are talking about GNR not being "allowed" to tour with Ticketmaster behind them need to come back to reality. If Tickemaster believes they can make money off a GNR tour in the US then it will happen and that's the end of the story. Azoff is a music manager and knows the score, he has been fired before and will be fired again. As the CEO of a massive publicly traded corporation, he's not going to fuck around and try to ban GNR from touring the US. In a position like that you don't just get to do whatever you feel like, you have to answer to the board and if they felt he was depriving the company of income because of some personal BS manifested in the form of outright blackballing an act that could make Ticketmaster a lot of money, he would get removed from his position

You think Axls new new new gnr can make TM money when they were playing to half filled to 3/4 filled arena's last time around? This is what two years later?

And did you even read my post? People love to talk shit out of context like JungleCat and pilferk. I said hopefully Axl did not burn any bridges with Azoff or he could make it difficult for Axl to tour in the US through TM.

I said he probably didnt so it wont even matter.

I am not sure how any of that is not true. I even said Axl probably did not burn any bridges and that TM talk even died down until JungleCat and pilferk brought it up again and flew off the handle.

Yes. Ever heard of Ticketmaster fees ?? C'mon. If Axl played a whole tour for half arena every show they would still make money.

[gnr-dave]

I didn't read any of your 4/5 posts on this page but I can assume they were along the lines of:

Axl is a dick

Beta is a dick

02 band was better

This whole situation is a joke

Everyone on here lacks common sense but me

Nah a few others have common sense, but most people on here cannot accept the truth.

You need to take off your Axl Rose colored glasses.

You claim im nuts blah blah blah, but the funny thing is you make the comments you make about Axl off these boards, and you will get laughed at.

Everyone knows Axl is crazy, a dickhead to most people, does not care about his fans, and his voice is pretty much gone (its not even close to what it was in the 90s let alone 80s like some of you nut jobs believe) , the only people who cannot accept that are a few hundred people on these boards.

Have you been to a show this year?

His voice is definitely at the best it has been since the 90s. The differences between 02, 06, and this year were very noticeable - and I was actually at shows, not talking out of my ass.

Also, Axl has generally been nice to almost anyone he's met fan-wise from what I've read. Never met him myself, so I can't comment beyond that. I'm betting you haven't met him, so perhaps you shouldn't be commenting either. The fact that he rants on the net doesn't make him an asshole. If that was the benchmark, the entire net would be guilty of it.

Just listen to the monitor mix and you will see this voice is shot.

Its getting better but its no where close to being as good as 92 (take the paris show for example). Anyone who claims differently is delusional.

He has no power left in his voice and its very thin sounding.

Plus he has to use backing tracks now, he never did back in the 80s or 90s.

He sounds decent yes, but his voice is 50% of what it once was. I am not saying he sounds like shit, because he doesnt. I am just saying he is not as good as he was in the 80s and 90s like people are claiming on this board.

As for him being nice to people he meets, I am not talking about that.

I am talking about the people he beats up because they have a camera, or he always seems to get in fights at airports, or picking fights with other bands lead singers, stuff like that.

He also disrespects fans for going on so late, no showing gigs and walking off mid set for stupid reasons..

Yes the going on late has been going on since the 90s but that doesnt make it right. Sure gnr fans have accepted it, but again its disrespectful to make fans wait til past 11pm to see him go on stage when the doors open at 6 or 7.

I've just read some of your post including this one and just wondering what the fuck are you doing on this board. Man, something really isn't rigt with you. Go visit some doctors immediately. You have a big problem.

Because I am a fan?

Here is the thing, just because I dont think Axl sounds as good as he used to means I am a hater?

Axl most gnr fans admit Axl is crazy by his antics, does that make us a hater?

I already said Axl sounds decent but his voice is shot. Im a big sound garden fan but SG fans know Cornels voice is shot now too.

Did you watch the superbowl half time show? What did you think of the who's singing?

If you think it was not great, does that make you a hater if you like their music?

Or they simply question inane assertions and questions you put forth.

Which, of course, is rather the point of posting ON A DISCUSSION FORUM.

If you just want to hear yourself talk....rather than listen/discuss....what are you doing HERE??!!

That is funny since you and your cronies bashed me instead of debating what I said.

Most people simplely disagreed with me without all the name calling BS you and a few others did.

I suggest you do the same. You dont debate you just start up with the personal BS instead of debating the point.

You should try it some time.

Edited February 19, 2010 by gnr-dave

[plonker88]

That is funny since you and your cronies bashed me instead of debating what I said.

Most people simplely disagreed with me without all the name calling BS you and a few others did.

I suggest you do the same. You dont debate you just start up with the personal BS instead of debating the point.

You should try it some time.

You should learn to quote and give me the chance to respond in the way you deem fit.

Edited February 19, 2010 by plonker88

[sourdeezl]

I AM NEW TO THE BOARDS, BUT U PEOPLE HERE ARE VERY SENSITIVE AND A LITTLE CRAZY I GOT TO SAY.

ARE AXLS VOICE AND THE BAND AS A WHOLE BETTER THAN WHAT IT WAS IN THE 90'S? OF COURSE IT FUCKING ISNT,

DOES THE MAN STILL BUT ON A GOOD SHOW? I THINK HE CLEARLY DOES.

AND ID STILL RATHER SEE AND LISTEN TO THE AXL OF TODAY THEN 90% OF THE ACTS TOURING THIS YEAR.

[gnr-dave]

That is funny since you and your cronies bashed me instead of debating what I said.

Most people simplely disagreed with me without all the name calling BS you and a few others did.

I suggest you do the same. You dont debate you just start up with the personal BS instead of debating the point.

You should try it some time.

You should learn to quote and give me the chance to respond in the way you deem fit.

I did not want to quote your whole post since I just replied to one part and scewed it up.

What ever, like I said, we should just agree to disagree and move on.

[Longpig]

Being a GN'R manager means helping Axl out.

I think if people have this idea that a good manager can market this band properly and get them MASSIVE again are deluding themselves.

The thing is you can't do anything with this band unless Axl wants to do it.

Not saying that's a good or bad thing, but you have to accept that when accepting the job. You will be dormant for a while then you will be expected to organise a world tour and deal with occasional day to day stuff. It's not like you're in charge of a new band or a 100% active band that is open to suggestions and you can properly "manage".

So if the new manager accepts this and can cope with the demands when he has them, then all should be fine.

But I hope fans here don't think anything will change with management, because it's all Axl's decision. Do you think the old managers didn't want to release an album and have Axl promote it? Of course they did, but for whatever reason that didn't happen. My guess is because Axl didn't feel good about how it was all handled but I doubt a change in management would really change how it was handled.

LP

[plonker88]

That is funny since you and your cronies bashed me instead of debating what I said.

Most people simplely disagreed with me without all the name calling BS you and a few others did.

I suggest you do the same. You dont debate you just start up with the personal BS instead of debating the point.

You should try it some time.

You should learn to quote and give me the chance to respond in the way you deem fit.

I did not want to quote your whole post since I just replied to one part and scewed it up.

What ever, like I said, we should just agree to disagree and move on.

I would like to debate with you man but the problem is that it's like bashing your head against a brick wall, there's no fun in it and it just feels like a pointless chore so yeah I divulge into the odd personal attack as it's the only real way to do it. Just try to lighten up with your posts and drop the whole "common sense" angle, it doesn't achieve anything and only makes you come across as arrogant. A never hurt anyone.

[pilferk]

That is funny since you and your cronies bashed me instead of debating what I said.

Most people simplely disagreed with me without all the name calling BS you and a few others did.

I suggest you do the same. You dont debate you just start up with the personal BS instead of debating the point.

You should try it some time.

Please point out where I "called you names" or insulted you in any way. Where I engaged in "personal BS" or bashed you. In fact, all I've done is address the "issues" in your posts. Nothing more, nothing less.

Saying you don't know, or suggesting you may not know, what you're talking about isn't insulting you.

Calling someone stupid is.

Nice try..but you're trying to rewrite history. In point of fact, I've done a remarkably good job (if I do say so myself) of taking the proverbial "high road" in our discussions.

Edit: Of course, reading the above responses, maybe your post wasn't directed at me....though it's impossible to tell given the abysmal "quoting" done in your post.

Edited February 19, 2010 by pilferk

[Guest Apollo]

I didn't read any of your 4/5 posts on this page but I can assume they were along the lines of:

Axl is a dick

Beta is a dick

02 band was better

This whole situation is a joke

Everyone on here lacks common sense but me

You just described gnr-dave perfectly.

The guy should write a book. He IS the most knowlegable forum member on Axl's life. Hell, he knows Axl better than Axl knows himself!!!!

I also love how he can't disagree with somebody without insulting them. Sort of shows how strong is "thoughts" are.

He is good for a laugh though.

I guess you miss the people giving me shit first, but of course you ignore that part.

You know what I am saying is true but you just want to kiss Axls ass and pretend its not.

Its funny you left that part out.

No Dave. I didn't miss the part where people have bashed you. It's because you CONSISTENTLY post negative comments about Axl. There is a small group of people on this forum that bash Axl on a daily basis, for everything the does. Axl could could cure cancer, solve world hunger and end all wars, put out an album that sold 50 million copies and 12 number one hits.............. and there are people on this forum would would come on and bash him. "How dare he cure cancer, what an egotistical prick. Look at all the doctors he just cost money. Nurse will be fired. Hospitals will have to raise the prices for other illness's now."

Fans just get tired of the constant bashing.

And besides your constant bashing of Axl, you do two other things that rub people the wrong way.

You seem to always resond to people who disagree with you two ways: you use the "common sense" insult or you make personal attacks against them. And the most annoying one of all --- if somebody is a fan or agrees with Axl, guys like YOU always throw out the "kiss Axl's ass" or swining on Axl's nuts comments.

Dave, I'm 39 years old. I have a great job that I love. I own my own home. I coach little league baseball, attend church every Sunday, coach special olympics, am raising a child as a single parent........."kissing Axl's ass" is just a stupid statement by you, soley designed to insult and discredit me (or anybody else that you disagree with). I could give a fuck if Axl reads my posts or not. If I was 12 years old, I might hope that Axl would read my post, send me a PM, and we'd strike up a great friendship. But at my age, I don't post here to kiss anybody's ass. That is just a ridiculous and juvenile thing for you to say.

I am never going to meet Axl. I'm never going to talk to Axl. I have no reason to kiss his ass - nor anybody's ass. I'm a grown man, my life doesn't work that way. I don't "kiss ass" of anybody. You treat people with dignity and respect, and that's how I live my life. If I ever found myself in the position where I was kissing a rock singer's ass, I would delete my account and step away from the computer and go outside and enjoy the real world.

People would respect your posts and respond in a non-insulting way, if you did the same thing. You are a passionate guy on here, but you need to realize that you really don't know what is going on behind the scenes in Axl's life. Because of a few internet articles and following axl's career through the media, you've come up with a vision of Axl's life in your mind that you ASSUME is fact. Unfortunately, no matter how strongly YOU feel about something - it doesn't make it fact. And unless you are able to respectful accept other people's opinions (even if you disagree) and then have a respectful debate about it - people will continue bashing you.

If you feel people bash you --- ignore those people. Don't fall down to their level.

I almost always disagree with your posts, because you are always bashing Axl, and because you come off like a know-it-all and you are really matter-of-fact about your "opinion" being fact, and if somebody disagrees with you - you always resort to insulting them as a person. ATTACK THE IDEA, NOT THE POSTER. And lose the "kissing Axl's ass" angle. People could say the same thing about you. Are you posting the negative shit all the time, hoping that Axl will read it and get his feelings hurt? Then you can sit back at your computer and pat yourself on the back? "I really got Axl with that one!"

[karlossacanell]

That is funny since you and your cronies bashed me instead of debating what I said.

Most people simplely disagreed with me without all the name calling BS you and a few others did.

I suggest you do the same. You dont debate you just start up with the personal BS instead of debating the point.

You should try it some time.

You should learn to quote and give me the chance to respond in the way you deem fit.

Learn to quote first, then we debate

[karlossacanell]

Apollo, I´m with you. You almost make me cry with your speech ... I only missed a film sad music while reading it ---

You are right, man. People must debate without insult or attack the poster in a personal level.

Sometimes you get bothered not because the critic or the opinion but for the way people do critics and give opinions...

We should just relax and enjoy these conversations giving our differents points of views with passion and respet and without insults...

[gnr-dave]

I didn't read any of your 4/5 posts on this page but I can assume they were along the lines of:

Axl is a dick

Beta is a dick

02 band was better

This whole situation is a joke

Everyone on here lacks common sense but me

You just described gnr-dave perfectly.

The guy should write a book. He IS the most knowlegable forum member on Axl's life. Hell, he knows Axl better than Axl knows himself!!!!

I also love how he can't disagree with somebody without insulting them. Sort of shows how strong is "thoughts" are.

He is good for a laugh though.

I guess you miss the people giving me shit first, but of course you ignore that part.

You know what I am saying is true but you just want to kiss Axls ass and pretend its not.

Its funny you left that part out.

No Dave. I didn't miss the part where people have bashed you. It's because you CONSISTENTLY post negative comments about Axl. There is a small group of people on this forum that bash Axl on a daily basis, for everything the does. Axl could could cure cancer, solve world hunger and end all wars, put out an album that sold 50 million copies and 12 number one hits.............. and there are people on this forum would would come on and bash him. "How dare he cure cancer, what an egotistical prick. Look at all the doctors he just cost money. Nurse will be fired. Hospitals will have to raise the prices for other illness's now."

Fans just get tired of the constant bashing.

And besides your constant bashing of Axl, you do two other things that rub people the wrong way.

You seem to always resond to people who disagree with you two ways: you use the "common sense" insult or you make personal attacks against them. And the most annoying one of all --- if somebody is a fan or agrees with Axl, guys like YOU always throw out the "kiss Axl's ass" or swining on Axl's nuts comments.

Dave, I'm 39 years old. I have a great job that I love. I own my own home. I coach little league baseball, attend church every Sunday, coach special olympics, am raising a child as a single parent........."kissing Axl's ass" is just a stupid statement by you, soley designed to insult and discredit me (or anybody else that you disagree with). I could give a fuck if Axl reads my posts or not. If I was 12 years old, I might hope that Axl would read my post, send me a PM, and we'd strike up a great friendship. But at my age, I don't post here to kiss anybody's ass. That is just a ridiculous and juvenile thing for you to say.

I am never going to meet Axl. I'm never going to talk to Axl. I have no reason to kiss his ass - nor anybody's ass. I'm a grown man, my life doesn't work that way. I don't "kiss ass" of anybody. You treat people with dignity and respect, and that's how I live my life. If I ever found myself in the position where I was kissing a rock singer's ass, I would delete my account and step away from the computer and go outside and enjoy the real world.

People would respect your posts and respond in a non-insulting way, if you did the same thing. You are a passionate guy on here, but you need to realize that you really don't know what is going on behind the scenes in Axl's life. Because of a few internet articles and following axl's career through the media, you've come up with a vision of Axl's life in your mind that you ASSUME is fact. Unfortunately, no matter how strongly YOU feel about something - it doesn't make it fact. And unless you are able to respectful accept other people's opinions (even if you disagree) and then have a respectful debate about it - people will continue bashing you.

If you feel people bash you --- ignore those people. Don't fall down to their level.

I almost always disagree with your posts, because you are always bashing Axl, and because you come off like a know-it-all and you are really matter-of-fact about your "opinion" being fact, and if somebody disagrees with you - you always resort to insulting them as a person. ATTACK THE IDEA, NOT THE POSTER. And lose the "kissing Axl's ass" angle. People could say the same thing about you. Are you posting the negative shit all the time, hoping that Axl will read it and get his feelings hurt? Then you can sit back at your computer and pat yourself on the back? "I really got Axl with that one!"

Apollo, as you can see from this thread,, I never start off with insulting posts until certain people start up with that.

Look at the whole TM thing for example, everyone was discussing it fine, until a few people started in, then it went down hill.

People get pissy because I am not 100 pro Axl, then once they start with personal stuff, I start with it

The thread was going fine until JungleCat made his stupid comment that added nothing to the debate.

All he did was cupcake in this thread and detrailed it. He is the one who brought in the name calling.

Look at all the posts before his, everyone was playing nice. I even ignored his first two insults.

I treat the posters with respect that give me respect. Have I ever insulted you? Nope.

Its a two way street. People love to bait on this board then cry when I or others insult back eventhough that person started it.

The mods need to start taking action at the first insult then it wont esculate to what it does. It seems its only ok to bash if you are "defending" Axl.

As for me always bashing Axl, that is simply not true, I will make a statement and it can be mostly good and a few parts where is critizing Axl, then the usual suspects will jump on the few parts that they deemed not positive.

Example, where I said Axl sounds decent but he does not sound any where close to the 80s or even 90s,. and that gets turned into Dave said Axl sounds like crap.

Edited February 19, 2010 by gnr-dave

[itsjustme]

Apollo, I totally agree with this statement; " You treat people with dignity and respect, and that's how I live my life." Thats how I wish all people were.

[Boazg]

I didn't read any of your 4/5 posts on this page but I can assume they were along the lines of:

Axl is a dick

Beta is a dick

02 band was better

This whole situation is a joke

Everyone on here lacks common sense but me

You just described gnr-dave perfectly.

The guy should write a book. He IS the most knowlegable forum member on Axl's life. Hell, he knows Axl better than Axl knows himself!!!!

I also love how he can't disagree with somebody without insulting them. Sort of shows how strong is "thoughts" are.

He is good for a laugh though.

I guess you miss the people giving me shit first, but of course you ignore that part.

You know what I am saying is true but you just want to kiss Axls ass and pretend its not.

Its funny you left that part out.

No Dave. I didn't miss the part where people have bashed you. It's because you CONSISTENTLY post negative comments about Axl. There is a small group of people on this forum that bash Axl on a daily basis, for everything the does. Axl could could cure cancer, solve world hunger and end all wars, put out an album that sold 50 million copies and 12 number one hits.............. and there are people on this forum would would come on and bash him. "How dare he cure cancer, what an egotistical prick. Look at all the doctors he just cost money. Nurse will be fired. Hospitals will have to raise the prices for other illness's now."

Fans just get tired of the constant bashing.

And besides your constant bashing of Axl, you do two other things that rub people the wrong way.

You seem to always resond to people who disagree with you two ways: you use the "common sense" insult or you make personal attacks against them. And the most annoying one of all --- if somebody is a fan or agrees with Axl, guys like YOU always throw out the "kiss Axl's ass" or swining on Axl's nuts comments.

Dave, I'm 39 years old. I have a great job that I love. I own my own home. I coach little league baseball, attend church every Sunday, coach special olympics, am raising a child as a single parent........."kissing Axl's ass" is just a stupid statement by you, soley designed to insult and discredit me (or anybody else that you disagree with). I could give a fuck if Axl reads my posts or not. If I was 12 years old, I might hope that Axl would read my post, send me a PM, and we'd strike up a great friendship. But at my age, I don't post here to kiss anybody's ass. That is just a ridiculous and juvenile thing for you to say.

I am never going to meet Axl. I'm never going to talk to Axl. I have no reason to kiss his ass - nor anybody's ass. I'm a grown man, my life doesn't work that way. I don't "kiss ass" of anybody. You treat people with dignity and respect, and that's how I live my life. If I ever found myself in the position where I was kissing a rock singer's ass, I would delete my account and step away from the computer and go outside and enjoy the real world.

People would respect your posts and respond in a non-insulting way, if you did the same thing. You are a passionate guy on here, but you need to realize that you really don't know what is going on behind the scenes in Axl's life. Because of a few internet articles and following axl's career through the media, you've come up with a vision of Axl's life in your mind that you ASSUME is fact. Unfortunately, no matter how strongly YOU feel about something - it doesn't make it fact. And unless you are able to respectful accept other people's opinions (even if you disagree) and then have a respectful debate about it - people will continue bashing you.

If you feel people bash you --- ignore those people. Don't fall down to their level.

I almost always disagree with your posts, because you are always bashing Axl, and because you come off like a know-it-all and you are really matter-of-fact about your "opinion" being fact, and if somebody disagrees with you - you always resort to insulting them as a person. ATTACK THE IDEA, NOT THE POSTER. And lose the "kissing Axl's ass" angle. People could say the same thing about you. Are you posting the negative shit all the time, hoping that Axl will read it and get his feelings hurt? Then you can sit back at your computer and pat yourself on the back? "I really got Axl with that one!"

Apollo, as you can see from this thread,, I never start off with insulting posts until certain people start up with that.

Look at the whole TM thing for example, everyone was discussing it fine, until a few people started in, then it went down hill.

People get pissy because I am not 100 pro Axl, then once they start with personal stuff, I start with it

The thread was going fine until JungleCat made his stupid comment that added nothing to the debate.

All he did was cupcake in this thread and detrailed it. He is the one who brought in the name calling.

Look at all the posts before his, everyone was playing nice. I even ignored his first two insults.

I treat the posters with respect that give me respect. Have I ever insulted you? Nope.

Its a two way street. People love to bait on this board then cry when I or others insult back eventhough that person started it.

The mods need to start taking action at the first insult then it wont esculate to what it does. It seems its only ok to bash if you are "defending" Axl.

As for me always bashing Axl, that is simply not true, I will make a statement and it can be mostly good and a few parts where is critizing Axl, then the usual suspects will jump on the few parts that they deemed not positive.

Example, where I said Axl sounds decent but he does not sound any where close to the 80s or even 90s,. and that gets turned into Dave said Axl sounds like crap.

Ok Dave, You call yourself a GN'R fan?

What are you constantly saying is that:

You don't like how Axl sounds, you think his voice is gone, his voice isn't close to what it was, he disrespects his fans, he beats people, he is dickhead, he is crazy, sick and everyone are aware of that exept few of us on this board that wears AXL ROSE colored glasses. Everyone who doesn't agree with you are kissing Axl's ass. You don't like Beta, Fernando, you think that all those who surround him are 'yes-man' people, with no personality.

And the best part of all is that you think that Chinese democracy was the biggest joke in rock and it suck.

So, you think somebody bashing you?

Frankly, I just don't know what to debate with you.

And yes, you call yourself a fan, OK, but tell me why???

[pilferk]

Apollo, as you can see from this thread,, I never start off with insulting posts until certain people start up with that.

Look at the whole TM thing for example, everyone was discussing it fine, until a few people started in, then it went down hill.

Please revisit our "conversation".

Because it was assuredly YOU (and, in fact, it was only you, through out) who resorted to personal insults and name calling.

Let's not rewrite history, eh?

People get pissy because I am not 100 pro Axl, then once they start with personal stuff, I start with it

Or they point out you're wrong...as in my case.

The thread was going fine until JungleCat made his stupid comment that added nothing to the debate.

All he did was cupcake in this thread and detrailed it. He is the one who brought in the name calling.

Hmmmm.....let's see.

I see junglecat calling you a cupcake AFTER you said Axl was insane.

Then I see a lot of you saying things like this:

I think you have your head too far up your ass you did not get the jist of my post.

You are just too stupid to make the connection of what I said

I know you think the more times you say something you think your small brain will start to believe its tru

I am sorry if you cannot get this through your thick skull

So maybe you can point out where EVERYONE else started it, eh?

Look at all the posts before his, everyone was playing nice. I even ignored his first two insults.

Which two? The only one I see is his "cupcake" comment.

In the previous posts to that, he actually comments on your points.

I treat the posters with respect that give me respect. Have I ever insulted you? Nope.

Ahem....

Its a two way street. People love to bait on this board then cry when I or others insult back eventhough that person started it.

The mods need to start taking action at the first insult then it wont esculate to what it does. It seems its only ok to bash if you are "defending" Axl.

I actually agree with you.

The mods should take action. EQUAL action.....

Be careful what you wish for, eh?

[pilferk]

Apollo, I totally agree with this statement; " You treat people with dignity and respect, and that's how I live my life." Thats how I wish all people were.

Totally agree. Reasonable people can reasonably disagree.....

There's no issue with disagreeing with someone's opinion, or pointing out that someone might not be knowledgeable about a certain subject. There's no issue with voicing your dissent on their points.

But I think calling people stupid, resorting to name calling, or any other personal attacks/insult not only undermines/detracts from any point you might have, but is counter-productive to being able to discuss ANYTHING. It becomes overwhelming "background" noise.....

And I do agree with gnr-Dave...maybe the mods should take steps to curtail that.

[SuperSock]

I didn't read any of your 4/5 posts on this page but I can assume they were along the lines of:

Axl is a dick

Beta is a dick

02 band was better

This whole situation is a joke

Everyone on here lacks common sense but me

You just described gnr-dave perfectly.

The guy should write a book. He IS the most knowlegable forum member on Axl's life. Hell, he knows Axl better than Axl knows himself!!!!

I also love how he can't disagree with somebody without insulting them. Sort of shows how strong is "thoughts" are.

He is good for a laugh though.

I guess you miss the people giving me shit first, but of course you ignore that part.

You know what I am saying is true but you just want to kiss Axls ass and pretend its not.

Its funny you left that part out.

No Dave. I didn't miss the part where people have bashed you. It's because you CONSISTENTLY post negative comments about Axl. There is a small group of people on this forum that bash Axl on a daily basis, for everything the does. Axl could could cure cancer, solve world hunger and end all wars, put out an album that sold 50 million copies and 12 number one hits.............. and there are people on this forum would would come on and bash him. "How dare he cure cancer, what an egotistical prick. Look at all the doctors he just cost money. Nurse will be fired. Hospitals will have to raise the prices for other illness's now."

Fans just get tired of the constant bashing.

And besides your constant bashing of Axl, you do two other things that rub people the wrong way.

You seem to always resond to people who disagree with you two ways: you use the "common sense" insult or you make personal attacks against them. And the most annoying one of all --- if somebody is a fan or agrees with Axl, guys like YOU always throw out the "kiss Axl's ass" or swining on Axl's nuts comments.

Dave, I'm 39 years old. I have a great job that I love. I own my own home. I coach little league baseball, attend church every Sunday, coach special olympics, am raising a child as a single parent........."kissing Axl's ass" is just a stupid statement by you, soley designed to insult and discredit me (or anybody else that you disagree with). I could give a fuck if Axl reads my posts or not. If I was 12 years old, I might hope that Axl would read my post, send me a PM, and we'd strike up a great friendship. But at my age, I don't post here to kiss anybody's ass. That is just a ridiculous and juvenile thing for you to say.

I am never going to meet Axl. I'm never going to talk to Axl. I have no reason to kiss his ass - nor anybody's ass. I'm a grown man, my life doesn't work that way. I don't "kiss ass" of anybody. You treat people with dignity and respect, and that's how I live my life. If I ever found myself in the position where I was kissing a rock singer's ass, I would delete my account and step away from the computer and go outside and enjoy the real world.

People would respect your posts and respond in a non-insulting way, if you did the same thing. You are a passionate guy on here, but you need to realize that you really don't know what is going on behind the scenes in Axl's life. Because of a few internet articles and following axl's career through the media, you've come up with a vision of Axl's life in your mind that you ASSUME is fact. Unfortunately, no matter how strongly YOU feel about something - it doesn't make it fact. And unless you are able to respectful accept other people's opinions (even if you disagree) and then have a respectful debate about it - people will continue bashing you.

If you feel people bash you --- ignore those people. Don't fall down to their level.

I almost always disagree with your posts, because you are always bashing Axl, and because you come off like a know-it-all and you are really matter-of-fact about your "opinion" being fact, and if somebody disagrees with you - you always resort to insulting them as a person. ATTACK THE IDEA, NOT THE POSTER. And lose the "kissing Axl's ass" angle. People could say the same thing about you. Are you posting the negative shit all the time, hoping that Axl will read it and get his feelings hurt? Then you can sit back at your computer and pat yourself on the back? "I really got Axl with that one!"

Apollo, as you can see from this thread,, I never start off with insulting posts until certain people start up with that.

Look at the whole TM thing for example, everyone was discussing it fine, until a few people started in, then it went down hill.

People get pissy because I am not 100 pro Axl, then once they start with personal stuff, I start with it

The thread was going fine until JungleCat made his stupid comment that added nothing to the debate.

All he did was cupcake in this thread and detrailed it. He is the one who brought in the name calling.

Look at all the posts before his, everyone was playing nice. I even ignored his first two insults.

I treat the posters with respect that give me respect. Have I ever insulted you? Nope.

Its a two way street. People love to bait on this board then cry when I or others insult back eventhough that person started it.

The mods need to start taking action at the first insult then it wont esculate to what it does. It seems its only ok to bash if you are "defending" Axl.

As for me always bashing Axl, that is simply not true, I will make a statement and it can be mostly good and a few parts where is critizing Axl, then the usual suspects will jump on the few parts that they deemed not positive.

Example, where I said Axl sounds decent but he does not sound any where close to the 80s or even 90s,. and that gets turned into Dave said Axl sounds like crap.

Ok Dave, You call yourself a GN'R fan?

What are you constantly saying is that:

You don't like how Axl sounds, you think his voice is gone, his voice isn't close to what it was, he disrespects his fans, he beats people, he is dickhead, he is crazy, sick and everyone are aware of that exept few of us on this board that wears AXL ROSE colored glasses. Everyone who doesn't agree with you are kissing Axl's ass. You don't like Beta, Fernando, you think that all those who surround him are 'yes-man' people, with no personality.

And the best part of all is that you think that Chinese democracy was the biggest joke in rock and it suck.

So, you think somebody bashing you?

Frankly, I just don't know what to debate with you.

And yes, you call yourself a fan, OK, but tell me why???

Agree 100% Most of us here actually like GNR and also Chinese Democracy-so why all the seething hatred and snarky comments out of a few contributors? An opinion does not equal fact, however often repeated.

[gnr-dave]

I didn't read any of your 4/5 posts on this page but I can assume they were along the lines of:

Axl is a dick

Beta is a dick

02 band was better

This whole situation is a joke

Everyone on here lacks common sense but me

You just described gnr-dave perfectly.

The guy should write a book. He IS the most knowlegable forum member on Axl's life. Hell, he knows Axl better than Axl knows himself!!!!

I also love how he can't disagree with somebody without insulting them. Sort of shows how strong is "thoughts" are.

He is good for a laugh though.

I guess you miss the people giving me shit first, but of course you ignore that part.

You know what I am saying is true but you just want to kiss Axls ass and pretend its not.

Its funny you left that part out.

No Dave. I didn't miss the part where people have bashed you. It's because you CONSISTENTLY post negative comments about Axl. There is a small group of people on this forum that bash Axl on a daily basis, for everything the does. Axl could could cure cancer, solve world hunger and end all wars, put out an album that sold 50 million copies and 12 number one hits.............. and there are people on this forum would would come on and bash him. "How dare he cure cancer, what an egotistical prick. Look at all the doctors he just cost money. Nurse will be fired. Hospitals will have to raise the prices for other illness's now."

Fans just get tired of the constant bashing.

And besides your constant bashing of Axl, you do two other things that rub people the wrong way.

You seem to always resond to people who disagree with you two ways: you use the "common sense" insult or you make personal attacks against them. And the most annoying one of all --- if somebody is a fan or agrees with Axl, guys like YOU always throw out the "kiss Axl's ass" or swining on Axl's nuts comments.

Dave, I'm 39 years old. I have a great job that I love. I own my own home. I coach little league baseball, attend church every Sunday, coach special olympics, am raising a child as a single parent........."kissing Axl's ass" is just a stupid statement by you, soley designed to insult and discredit me (or anybody else that you disagree with). I could give a fuck if Axl reads my posts or not. If I was 12 years old, I might hope that Axl would read my post, send me a PM, and we'd strike up a great friendship. But at my age, I don't post here to kiss anybody's ass. That is just a ridiculous and juvenile thing for you to say.

I am never going to meet Axl. I'm never going to talk to Axl. I have no reason to kiss his ass - nor anybody's ass. I'm a grown man, my life doesn't work that way. I don't "kiss ass" of anybody. You treat people with dignity and respect, and that's how I live my life. If I ever found myself in the position where I was kissing a rock singer's ass, I would delete my account and step away from the computer and go outside and enjoy the real world.

People would respect your posts and respond in a non-insulting way, if you did the same thing. You are a passionate guy on here, but you need to realize that you really don't know what is going on behind the scenes in Axl's life. Because of a few internet articles and following axl's career through the media, you've come up with a vision of Axl's life in your mind that you ASSUME is fact. Unfortunately, no matter how strongly YOU feel about something - it doesn't make it fact. And unless you are able to respectful accept other people's opinions (even if you disagree) and then have a respectful debate about it - people will continue bashing you.

If you feel people bash you --- ignore those people. Don't fall down to their level.

I almost always disagree with your posts, because you are always bashing Axl, and because you come off like a know-it-all and you are really matter-of-fact about your "opinion" being fact, and if somebody disagrees with you - you always resort to insulting them as a person. ATTACK THE IDEA, NOT THE POSTER. And lose the "kissing Axl's ass" angle. People could say the same thing about you. Are you posting the negative shit all the time, hoping that Axl will read it and get his feelings hurt? Then you can sit back at your computer and pat yourself on the back? "I really got Axl with that one!"

Apollo, as you can see from this thread,, I never start off with insulting posts until certain people start up with that.

Look at the whole TM thing for example, everyone was discussing it fine, until a few people started in, then it went down hill.

People get pissy because I am not 100 pro Axl, then once they start with personal stuff, I start with it

The thread was going fine until JungleCat made his stupid comment that added nothing to the debate.

All he did was cupcake in this thread and detrailed it. He is the one who brought in the name calling.

Look at all the posts before his, everyone was playing nice. I even ignored his first two insults.

I treat the posters with respect that give me respect. Have I ever insulted you? Nope.

Its a two way street. People love to bait on this board then cry when I or others insult back eventhough that person started it.

The mods need to start taking action at the first insult then it wont esculate to what it does. It seems its only ok to bash if you are "defending" Axl.

As for me always bashing Axl, that is simply not true, I will make a statement and it can be mostly good and a few parts where is critizing Axl, then the usual suspects will jump on the few parts that they deemed not positive.

Example, where I said Axl sounds decent but he does not sound any where close to the 80s or even 90s,. and that gets turned into Dave said Axl sounds like crap.

Ok Dave, You call yourself a GN'R fan?

What are you constantly saying is that:

You don't like how Axl sounds, you think his voice is gone, his voice isn't close to what it was, he disrespects his fans, he beats people, he is dickhead, he is crazy, sick and everyone are aware of that exept few of us on this board that wears AXL ROSE colored glasses. Everyone who doesn't agree with you are kissing Axl's ass. You don't like Beta, Fernando, you think that all those who surround him are 'yes-man' people, with no personality.

And the best part of all is that you think that Chinese democracy was the biggest joke in rock and it suck.

So, you think somebody bashing you?

Frankly, I just don't know what to debate with you.

And yes, you call yourself a fan, OK, but tell me why???

And people wonder why I need to repeat myself. Did you EVER READ MY LAST POST.

I said Axl sounds decent but not as good as he used to. His voice is shot compared to how it used to sound. It happens, its being honest not a hater.

As for him being a dickhead etc, how is any of that not true? Does he not walk off stage early? Does he not sometimes not show up for gigs? Does he not go on super late? Does he not get into fights with fans at shows or airports , other musicans or other events?

How is any of that not true? Oasis fans think Liam is a jerk but are they haters????

People need to learn you can be a fan but you dont have ignore all of axls faults you can point them out. The funny thing is some people think those things he does are "cool" and they are not considred bashers but since I think its wrong I am a hater.

pilferk did this thread not go off track after pilferk started bashing me?

And he did because I said Axls manager said he was insane and agreed with it? So that gives him the right to bash?

So you proved my point, if someone is defending Axl its ok to bash, but if someone is a so called hater its wrong.

If he never made his trolling posts, this thread never would have gone down hill, the mods should have nipped that in the bud and put an end to it but they didnt.

Its funny you are defending him for his trolling, then when I just defend myself and so the same thing back, oh I m wrong.

You proved my point perfectly, thanks. I knew you would.

As for careful what I wish for, please if they would stop the defenders of Axl from trolling on me first, I would never even start up.

And the funny thing is, something the cupcakes still cannot figure out when they start on me, its so easy to push their buttons.

It makes them go crazy, and I just sit back and laugh.

The thead was fine until the first trolling comment was made, and it wasnt made by me.

So you should go talk to that person first, but of course you wont since they were defending Axls honor right?

Edited February 19, 2010 by gnr-dave

[Boazg]

I didn't read any of your 4/5 posts on this page but I can assume they were along the lines of:

Axl is a dick

Beta is a dick

02 band was better

This whole situation is a joke

Everyone on here lacks common sense but me

You just described gnr-dave perfectly.

The guy should write a book. He IS the most knowlegable forum member on Axl's life. Hell, he knows Axl better than Axl knows himself!!!!

I also love how he can't disagree with somebody without insulting them. Sort of shows how strong is "thoughts" are.

He is good for a laugh though.

I guess you miss the people giving me shit first, but of course you ignore that part.

You know what I am saying is true but you just want to kiss Axls ass and pretend its not.

Its funny you left that part out.

No Dave. I didn't miss the part where people have bashed you. It's because you CONSISTENTLY post negative comments about Axl. There is a small group of people on this forum that bash Axl on a daily basis, for everything the does. Axl could could cure cancer, solve world hunger and end all wars, put out an album that sold 50 million copies and 12 number one hits.............. and there are people on this forum would would come on and bash him. "How dare he cure cancer, what an egotistical prick. Look at all the doctors he just cost money. Nurse will be fired. Hospitals will have to raise the prices for other illness's now."

Fans just get tired of the constant bashing.

And besides your constant bashing of Axl, you do two other things that rub people the wrong way.

You seem to always resond to people who disagree with you two ways: you use the "common sense" insult or you make personal attacks against them. And the most annoying one of all --- if somebody is a fan or agrees with Axl, guys like YOU always throw out the "kiss Axl's ass" or swining on Axl's nuts comments.

Dave, I'm 39 years old. I have a great job that I love. I own my own home. I coach little league baseball, attend church every Sunday, coach special olympics, am raising a child as a single parent........."kissing Axl's ass" is just a stupid statement by you, soley designed to insult and discredit me (or anybody else that you disagree with). I could give a fuck if Axl reads my posts or not. If I was 12 years old, I might hope that Axl would read my post, send me a PM, and we'd strike up a great friendship. But at my age, I don't post here to kiss anybody's ass. That is just a ridiculous and juvenile thing for you to say.

I am never going to meet Axl. I'm never going to talk to Axl. I have no reason to kiss his ass - nor anybody's ass. I'm a grown man, my life doesn't work that way. I don't "kiss ass" of anybody. You treat people with dignity and respect, and that's how I live my life. If I ever found myself in the position where I was kissing a rock singer's ass, I would delete my account and step away from the computer and go outside and enjoy the real world.

People would respect your posts and respond in a non-insulting way, if you did the same thing. You are a passionate guy on here, but you need to realize that you really don't know what is going on behind the scenes in Axl's life. Because of a few internet articles and following axl's career through the media, you've come up with a vision of Axl's life in your mind that you ASSUME is fact. Unfortunately, no matter how strongly YOU feel about something - it doesn't make it fact. And unless you are able to respectful accept other people's opinions (even if you disagree) and then have a respectful debate about it - people will continue bashing you.

If you feel people bash you --- ignore those people. Don't fall down to their level.

I almost always disagree with your posts, because you are always bashing Axl, and because you come off like a know-it-all and you are really matter-of-fact about your "opinion" being fact, and if somebody disagrees with you - you always resort to insulting them as a person. ATTACK THE IDEA, NOT THE POSTER. And lose the "kissing Axl's ass" angle. People could say the same thing about you. Are you posting the negative shit all the time, hoping that Axl will read it and get his feelings hurt? Then you can sit back at your computer and pat yourself on the back? "I really got Axl with that one!"

Apollo, as you can see from this thread,, I never start off with insulting posts until certain people start up with that.

Look at the whole TM thing for example, everyone was discussing it fine, until a few people started in, then it went down hill.

People get pissy because I am not 100 pro Axl, then once they start with personal stuff, I start with it

The thread was going fine until JungleCat made his stupid comment that added nothing to the debate.

All he did was cupcake in this thread and detrailed it. He is the one who brought in the name calling.

Look at all the posts before his, everyone was playing nice. I even ignored his first two insults.

I treat the posters with respect that give me respect. Have I ever insulted you? Nope.

Its a two way street. People love to bait on this board then cry when I or others insult back eventhough that person started it.

The mods need to start taking action at the first insult then it wont esculate to what it does. It seems its only ok to bash if you are "defending" Axl.

As for me always bashing Axl, that is simply not true, I will make a statement and it can be mostly good and a few parts where is critizing Axl, then the usual suspects will jump on the few parts that they deemed not positive.

Example, where I said Axl sounds decent but he does not sound any where close to the 80s or even 90s,. and that gets turned into Dave said Axl sounds like crap.

Ok Dave, You call yourself a GN'R fan?

What are you constantly saying is that:

You don't like how Axl sounds, you think his voice is gone, his voice isn't close to what it was, he disrespects his fans, he beats people, he is dickhead, he is crazy, sick and everyone are aware of that exept few of us on this board that wears AXL ROSE colored glasses. Everyone who doesn't agree with you are kissing Axl's ass. You don't like Beta, Fernando, you think that all those who surround him are 'yes-man' people, with no personality.

And the best part of all is that you think that Chinese democracy was the biggest joke in rock and it suck.

So, you think somebody bashing you?

Frankly, I just don't know what to debate with you.

And yes, you call yourself a fan, OK, but tell me why???

And people wonder why I need to repeat myself. Did you EVER READ MY LAST POST.

I said Axl sounds decent but not as good as he used to. His voice is shot compared to how it used to sound. It happens, its being honest not a hater.

As for him being a dickhead etc, how is any of that not true? Does he not walk off stage early? Does he not sometimes not show up for gigs? Does he not go on super late? Does he not get into fights with fans at shows or airports , other musicans or other events?

How is any of that not true? Oasis fans think Liam is a jerk but are they haters????

People need to learn you can be a fan but you dont have ignore all of axls faults you can point them out. The funny thing is some people think those things he does are "cool" and they are not considred bashers but since I think its wrong I am a hater.

pilferk did this thread not go off track after pilferk started bashing me?

And he did because I said Axls manager said he was insane and agreed with it? So that gives him the right to bash?

So you proved my point, if someone is defending Axl its ok to bash, but if someone is a so called hater its wrong.

If he never made his trolling posts, this thread never would have gone down hill, the mods should have nipped that in the bud and put an end to it but they didnt.

Its funny you are defending him for his trolling, then when I just defend myself and so the same thing back, oh I m wrong.

You proved my point perfectly, thanks. I knew you would.

As for careful what I wish for, please if they would stop the defenders of Axl from trolling on me first, I would never even start up.

And the funny thing is, something the cupcakes still cannot figure out when they start on me, its so easy to push their buttons.

It makes them go crazy, and I just sit back and laugh.

The thead was fine until the first trolling comment was made, and it wasnt made by me.

So you should go talk to that person first, but of course you wont since they were defending Axls honor right?

Yes, Dave, I read your last post but I read the previus posts also. Perhaps you should read them. Obviously you forgot them.

[pilferk]

pilferk did this thread not go off track after pilferk started bashing me?

And he did because I said Axls manager said he was insane and agreed with it? So that gives him the right to bash?

No, because PILFERK (as in...me) never bashed you.

And I didn't say it gives him the right to bash you. I simply pointed out his one infraction doesn't much compare with your multiple ones...and I only cited the ones directed at me.

I also said, if you consider the cupcake comment bashing:

a ) I don't see the other two insults you say you ignored

b ) doing so doesn't/shouldn't give you carte blanche to treat the rest of those discussing the same topic, the same way.

In case you hadn't noticed, I'm not Jungle Cat. Neither are many of the other posters.

My momma taught me something long ago: Two wrongs don't make a right.

If you want the mods to wield the slapping stick, they should apply it everyone (including you) involved.

So you proved my point, if someone is defending Axl its ok to bash, but if someone is a so called hater its wrong.

I said (implied/wrote/inferred) no such thing. Had I wanted to make that point, I wouldn't have pointed out Junglecats cupcake comment. But I did, didn't I?

If he never made his trolling posts, this thread never would have gone down hill, the mods should have nipped that in the bud and put an end to it but they didnt.

Its funny you are defending him for his trolling, then when I just defend myself and so the same thing back, oh I m wrong.

You'll excuse me if I don't believe you...simply because your diatribe wasn't directed at JC....it was directed at others, including me. Blaming someone else for you derailing is not only a cop out, it's an appalling display of refusing to take any semblance of personal responsibility for your actions.

You can cry that it would never have gone off track if JC had not called you a cupcake.....but it doesn't hold water when the majority of YOUR transgressions had nothing to do with that bent of the conversation.

You proved my point perfectly, thanks. I knew you would.

The point that the mods should have stepped in and slapped you on the wrist? Thanks...glad I could help. Given you have such confidence in me, in making your argument for you, perhaps you should also lend the same confidence to my points in our earlier conversation.

As for careful what I wish for, please if they would stop the defenders of Axl from trolling on me first, I would never even start up.

And the funny thing is, something the cupcakes still cannot figure out when they start on me, its so easy to push their buttons.

It makes them go crazy, and I just sit back and laugh.

Obviously, by your responses to me....that's not the case. You can try to pass that off as true, but it's pretty transparent. You got ticked off that anyone (someone, I might add, who's worked in a venue, with TM, and has spent about 15+ years in corporate america) would question your supreme knowledge.

You're taking this stuff FAR too personally. The fact that, when someone pretty much obliterates your point, you can only resort to the personal stuff isn't something you can, now, discount.

To now try to blame YOUR actions on JC is beyond laughable. My 5 year old ends up in "time out" when he pulls that stuff....blaming his sisters when HE should know better.

The thead was fine until the first trolling comment was made, and it wasnt made by me.

So you should go talk to that person first, but of course you wont since they were defending Axls honor right?

They're not posting, trying to blame someone else for their actions.

You want me to say the cupcake comment was out of line? Sure. JC could have, instead, addressed WHY your comment was objectionable.

Now go ahead and admit YOU were wrong and apologize. Don't argue. Don't belabor the point. Just apologize (to me, the mods, and the group). And we can all move on.

I suspect you won't, because the truth is the above is just one big cop out. You're rationalizing, deflecting, and trying to shirk your part in all this.

But, to be perfectly clear, it's obvious to everyone else reading this that's what's going on. Just so you know.....

Edited February 19, 2010 by pilferk