Should Mick and Keith try to counsel Axl and Slash?

[Vincent Vega]

Seriously.

Mick and Keith's relationship took very nearly the same trajectory as Axl and Slash's. By the mid '80s they were in essence broken up because there was a power struggle between Mick and Keith; And while they've been able to pull it together because they realize being the Stones together is more money than themselves alone, those underlying issues are still there--In Keith's book you can see he's still very bitter at Mick in some ways, yet for money they've held it together since 1988 (Even though it seems they might've broken up again)

"The ROLLING STONES pair fell out in 2005 when the guitarist first said Sir Mick had a "small c**k".

Keith, 66, was forced to publicly apologise. Now he says Sir Mick's ex MARIANNE FAITHFULL "had no fun with Mick's tiny todger".

But he seems ready for a U-turn. "I was told that by others," he says in an interview with Caitlin Moran in The Times today.

His autobiography Life will be serialised in the paper from tomorrow.

Keith also claims that Sir Mick, 67, became "unbearable" in the '80s."

Do you think if they tried to talk to Axl and Slash, it'd help at all?

Edited January 14, 2011 by Indigo Child

[JAC185]

Mick and Keith's relationship took very nearly the same trajectory as Axl and Slash's. By the mid '80s they were in essence broken up because there was a power struggle between Mick and Keith; And while they've been able to pull it together because they realize being the Stones together is more money than themselves alone, those underlying issues are still there--In Keith's book you can see he's still very bitter at Mick in some ways, yet for money they've held it together since 1988 (Even though it seems they might've broken up again)

Yeah this is definitely Axls motivation in his career.

Just a shame nobody pointed out to him that he could have made more money had he kept Slash in the band.

[Vincent Vega]

Mick and Keith's relationship took very nearly the same trajectory as Axl and Slash's. By the mid '80s they were in essence broken up because there was a power struggle between Mick and Keith; And while they've been able to pull it together because they realize being the Stones together is more money than themselves alone, those underlying issues are still there--In Keith's book you can see he's still very bitter at Mick in some ways, yet for money they've held it together since 1988 (Even though it seems they might've broken up again)

Yeah this is definitely Axls motivation in his career.

Just a shame nobody pointed out to him that he could have made more money had he kept Slash in the band.

Well, Slash quit. He wasn't fired. Should Axl have held a gun to his head and told him stay in the band or I shoot you to death?

Actually, overall, despite the money end, Axl's probably lost more by continuing on with Guns than he would've if he went solo. Respect, fans, the media, etc, his reputation. I don't think he's in just for the money.

The Stones, from all accounts, however, are like a couple who got divorced but realized they couldn't financially make it on their own. So, while they don't really love each other anymore, they got back together just to be able to eat.

Personally, I'd prefer GN'R as it is now to a bunch of guys pretending to like each other for the dollar signs. Slash's fans probably don't care if a reunion would cause him to go back on Heroin. They just want to be appeased, fuck how Axl, Slash, Duff and Izzy feel or if it would kill them.

Edited January 14, 2011 by Indigo Child

[Vincent Vega]

Mick and Keef barely talk to each other so don't know if they would be very good councellors

Well, remember, it was Mick who DIRECTLY inspired Axl to take a very "business-like" approach to Guns. That led to the contracts, to him buying the name, and possibly indirectly to the demise of the original GN'R. Axl even said something to the effect of, "If you want to see a real dictator, go work for Mick Jagger!" in response to people who were claiming he was a dictator in that April 1990 Mick Wall interview. Mick's way of running the Stones really influenced Axl's beliefs, I think, on how a band should be run, and made Axl a little obsessive with all the finer points of GN'R's business apparatus.

I kind of believe that Chicago and the Stones gigs in 1989 were the turning point in (the original) Guns' history.

Edited January 14, 2011 by Indigo Child

[chesire78]

no if force things like this they never work. The beauty of forgiveness and friendship is that they are feelings you can't control and no else can either. We are drawn to and bond to certain people with little or explanation. sometimes we get hurt but the process of getting over that and wanting to start a friendship after that has to be natural for both people involved. no one can push that if they do it ruins the moment. also note axl hates people conspiring to get the outcome they or others want. If you have true intentions and are honest it works much better.

Edited January 14, 2011 by chesire78

[Mastodonny]

Mick and Keef barely talk to each other so don't know if they would be very good councellors

True but Keef says something in his book that is applicable here, he and Mick may not be friends but they are still brothers.

[RocketQueen1985]

NO!!!!!!!

MOVE ON!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[Unknown Caller]

Mick and Keith's relationship took very nearly the same trajectory as Axl and Slash's. By the mid '80s they were in essence broken up because there was a power struggle between Mick and Keith; And while they've been able to pull it together because they realize being the Stones together is more money than themselves alone, those underlying issues are still there--In Keith's book you can see he's still very bitter at Mick in some ways, yet for money they've held it together since 1988 (Even though it seems they might've broken up again)

Yeah this is definitely Axls motivation in his career.

Just a shame nobody pointed out to him that he could have made more money had he kept Slash in the band.

Well, Slash quit. He wasn't fired. Should Axl have held a gun to his head and told him stay in the band or I shoot you to death?

Let me kindly remind you that there is a reason why he quit.

[Vincent Vega]

Mick and Keith's relationship took very nearly the same trajectory as Axl and Slash's. By the mid '80s they were in essence broken up because there was a power struggle between Mick and Keith; And while they've been able to pull it together because they realize being the Stones together is more money than themselves alone, those underlying issues are still there--In Keith's book you can see he's still very bitter at Mick in some ways, yet for money they've held it together since 1988 (Even though it seems they might've broken up again)

Yeah this is definitely Axls motivation in his career.

Just a shame nobody pointed out to him that he could have made more money had he kept Slash in the band.

Well, Slash quit. He wasn't fired. Should Axl have held a gun to his head and told him stay in the band or I shoot you to death?

Let me kindly remind you that there is a reason why he quit.

A weak personality and anger over the fact that Guns wasn't going in HIS direction.

Let's face it. It wasn't about Blues Rock, or about Industrial. It was about power. Both Axl and Slash wanted power over Guns. They both have and had egos. Neither of them are saints. I champion the stronger man.

Now, we can agree that Axl made immense mistakes AFTER Slash left (not having an album out soon after, disappearing for 5 years, amongst other things), but Slash was the one who made the mistake in quitting. No matter how horrid the circumstances, he could've held his ground. It's like that quote, "If you can't stand the heat, get out of the kitchen." Look at Tommy. Tommy has played for 13 years now with the very same Axl Rose that Slash played with for 11. He's stood with Axl through probably one of the worst eras of Guns--The long, languishing wait for CD to be finished. Some guys are weaker, others are stronger.

You think Keith would've quit the Stones? No. Keith has balls.

[Apollo]

So why would a couple almost 50 year olds who were in a band together for a few years 15 years ago, need counceling from a couple almost 70 year old musicians????? Axl and Slash have moved on with their lives. They were in a band together, they weren't married, they aren't life-time best friends who had a fight. They aren't brothers who had a falling out.

.

They are a couple of guys who were in a band together a long time ago. The same magic and intensity that made them explode is the same thing that made them fall apart. But to be 15 years later and a fan trying to bring them together through counceling.....it borders on getting creepy. We should let two grown men decide what THEY want to do with their lives.

[Vincent Vega]

So why would a couple almost 50 year olds who were in a band together for a few years 15 years ago, need counceling from a couple almost 70 year old musicians????? Axl and Slash have moved on with their lives. They were in a band together, they weren't married, they aren't life-time best friends who had a fight. They aren't brothers who had a falling out.

.

They are a couple of guys who were in a band together a long time ago. The same magic and intensity that made them explode is the same thing that made them fall apart. But to be 15 years later and a fan trying to bring them together through counceling.....it borders on getting creepy. We should let two grown men decide what THEY want to do with their lives.

Since it's a crime on MyGNR to like anything but Slaxl, I must insist on any means necessary of resurrecting 1988.

I am on the good side now in the war.

[Unknown Caller]

Why would Slash waste his time? By that time Axl had the name so it was all a matter of time for his dismissal regardless.

[Vincent Vega]

Mick and Keith's relationship took very nearly the same trajectory as Axl and Slash's. By the mid '80s they were in essence broken up because there was a power struggle between Mick and Keith; And while they've been able to pull it together because they realize being the Stones together is more money than themselves alone, those underlying issues are still there--In Keith's book you can see he's still very bitter at Mick in some ways, yet for money they've held it together since 1988 (Even though it seems they might've broken up again)

Yeah this is definitely Axls motivation in his career.

Just a shame nobody pointed out to him that he could have made more money had he kept Slash in the band.

Well, Slash quit. He wasn't fired. Should Axl have held a gun to his head and told him stay in the band or I shoot you to death?

Let me kindly remind you that there is a reason why he quit.

A weak personality and anger over the fact that Guns wasn't going in HIS direction.

Let's face it. It wasn't about Blues Rock, or about Industrial. It was about power. Both Axl and Slash wanted power over Guns. They both have and had egos. Neither of them are saints. I champion the stronger man.

Now, we can agree that Axl made immense mistakes AFTER Slash left (not having an album out soon after, disappearing for 5 years, amongst other things), but Slash was the one who made the mistake in quitting. No matter how horrid the circumstances, he could've held his ground. It's like that quote, "If you can't stand the heat, get out of the kitchen." Look at Tommy. Tommy has played for 13 years now with the very same Axl Rose that Slash played with for 11. He's stood with Axl through probably one of the worst eras of Guns--The long, languishing wait for CD to be finished. Some guys are weaker, others are stronger.

You think Keith would've quit the Stones? No. Keith has balls.

Interviews with all the former members do not support your theory that Slash was trying to take over the band. Every former member has said the same thing. Axl became an ego maniac and wanted complete control. Well he got it as he drove all the others out of the band.....He tried to get Izzy to sign an employee contract and did the same to Slash and Duff. All evidence points to Axl trying to take over the band not Slash.

Your trying to compare Tommy's situation to Slash's? Slash was an equal partner to Axl while Tommy has never been anything but Axl's employee there is not comparison in the circumstances. Maybe Tommy is happy to hanging out and collecting a fat paycheck during all the inactivity. Slash is not happy unless he is playing and making new albums. He and Axl could never have lasted on that fact alone.

This stonger vs. weaker argument is bullshit and you are using it to justify Axl's fucking over his supposed brothers. The bottom line is he wanted total control of the band and he got it by stepping on a lot of people helped build GNR.

And I am happy he did.

Fuck Slash.

[Unknown Caller]

If only I could go back in time and show you how different this situation would be if Slash was never in GN'R. You would never see all or parts of the following songs: Welcome to the Jungle, It's So Easy, Nightrain[/i, Out Ta Get Me, Mr. Brownstone, Paradise City, My Michelle, Think About You, Sweet Child O' Mine, You're Crazy, Anything Goes, Rocket Queen, Patience, Used To Love Her, One In A Million, Right Next Door To Hell, Dust N' Bones, Perfect Crime, You Ain't The First, Bad Obsession, Back Off Bitch, Double Talkin' Jive, The Garden, Garden of Eden, Don't Damn Me, Bad Apples, Coma, Locomotive, You Could Be Mine, 14 Years, Civil War, Yesterdays, Get In The Ring, Shotgun Blues, Breakdown, Pretty Tied Up, So Fine, and Estranged.

You might have bits and pieces of November Rain and Estranged, but they would be nothing like they are now. I am just in complete disbelief how you are in a Guns N' Roses message board when you completely hate guitarist who wrote all of the songs in which the band is famous for. You've spent hundreds of hours on this site to completely trash perhaps the most influential member aside from Axl this band has ever had. Congratulations Miser, you are a total loser.

[Vincent Vega]

If only I could go back in time and show you how different this situation would be if Slash was never in GN'R. You would never see all or parts of the following songs: Welcome to the Jungle, It's So Easy, Nightrain[/i, Out Ta Get Me, Mr. Brownstone, Paradise City, My Michelle, Think About You, Sweet Child O' Mine, You're Crazy, Anything Goes, Rocket Queen, Patience, Used To Love Her, One In A Million, Right Next Door To Hell, Dust N' Bones, Perfect Crime, You Ain't The First, Bad Obsession, Back Off Bitch, Double Talkin' Jive, The Garden, Garden of Eden, Don't Damn Me, Bad Apples, Coma, Locomotive, You Could Be Mine, 14 Years, Civil War, Yesterdays, Get In The Ring, Shotgun Blues, Breakdown, Pretty Tied Up, So Fine, and Estranged.

You might have bits and pieces of November Rain and Estranged, but they would be nothing like they are now. I am just in complete disbelief how you are in a Guns N' Roses message board when you completely hate guitarist who wrote all of the songs in which the band is famous for. You've spent hundreds of hours on this site to completely trash perhaps the most influential member aside from Axl this band has ever had. Congratulations Miser, you are a total loser.

Hey, we're in two camps

You chose yours. I chose mine.

You trash Axl. I'll trash Slash in return.

See, I don't dislike Slash. But his fans who have waged basically war here and trolled here, yeah.

[Lose Your Illusions]

The falling through of Axl and Slash's relationship is alot deeper than one telling the other he has a small penis.

Edited January 14, 2011 by Lose Your Illusions

[Unknown Caller]

If only I could go back in time and show you how different this situation would be if Slash was never in GN'R. You would never see all or parts of the following songs: Welcome to the Jungle, It's So Easy, Nightrain[/i, Out Ta Get Me, Mr. Brownstone, Paradise City, My Michelle, Think About You, Sweet Child O' Mine, You're Crazy, Anything Goes, Rocket Queen, Patience, Used To Love Her, One In A Million, Right Next Door To Hell, Dust N' Bones, Perfect Crime, You Ain't The First, Bad Obsession, Back Off Bitch, Double Talkin' Jive, The Garden, Garden of Eden, Don't Damn Me, Bad Apples, Coma, Locomotive, You Could Be Mine, 14 Years, Civil War, Yesterdays, Get In The Ring, Shotgun Blues, Breakdown, Pretty Tied Up, So Fine, and Estranged.

You might have bits and pieces of November Rain and Estranged, but they would be nothing like they are now. I am just in complete disbelief how you are in a Guns N' Roses message board when you completely hate guitarist who wrote all of the songs in which the band is famous for. You've spent hundreds of hours on this site to completely trash perhaps the most influential member aside from Axl this band has ever had. Congratulations Miser, you are a total loser.

See, I don't dislike Slash.

Fuck Slash.

[Vincent Vega]

If only I could go back in time and show you how different this situation would be if Slash was never in GN'R. You would never see all or parts of the following songs: Welcome to the Jungle, It's So Easy, Nightrain[/i, Out Ta Get Me, Mr. Brownstone, Paradise City, My Michelle, Think About You, Sweet Child O' Mine, You're Crazy, Anything Goes, Rocket Queen, Patience, Used To Love Her, One In A Million, Right Next Door To Hell, Dust N' Bones, Perfect Crime, You Ain't The First, Bad Obsession, Back Off Bitch, Double Talkin' Jive, The Garden, Garden of Eden, Don't Damn Me, Bad Apples, Coma, Locomotive, You Could Be Mine, 14 Years, Civil War, Yesterdays, Get In The Ring, Shotgun Blues, Breakdown, Pretty Tied Up, So Fine, and Estranged.

You might have bits and pieces of November Rain and Estranged, but they would be nothing like they are now. I am just in complete disbelief how you are in a Guns N' Roses message board when you completely hate guitarist who wrote all of the songs in which the band is famous for. You've spent hundreds of hours on this site to completely trash perhaps the most influential member aside from Axl this band has ever had. Congratulations Miser, you are a total loser.

See, I don't dislike Slash.

Fuck Slash.

His supporters make me wish he'd go away.

He's overexposed on this forum...And you guys push an anti-Axl, anti-New GN'R, pro Slash message in such a hatefilled way.

[Unknown Caller]

So you're blaming it on others? You are the one who started this thread Miser, along with the other 500+ similar discussions who stir up controversy between Slash and Axl debates (i.e. "What's wrong with Evolution" etc.). You have no right to blame anyone but yourself.

[Vincent Vega]

So you're blaming it on others? You are the one who started this thread Miser, along with the other 500+ similar discussions who stir up controversy between Slash and Axl debates (i.e. "What's wrong with Evolution" etc.). You have no right to blame anyone but yourself.

It was started by your side trolling as soon as the tour ended.

As soon as the band said 'We're Guns N' Roses" your team came out of the woodwork.

[Orsys]

Stones already counselled. Keith advised Slash that basically no matter what happened, you don't leave your band. Slash left anyway. Counsel didn't change the outcome.

[FuddMckagan]

Miser, you're half the reason Slash is so "exposed" on this forum. You constantly make threads bashing him or saying that he's a weak minded individual. Maybe if you didn't make such dumb ass threads he wouldn't be talked about as much?

Just something to think about.

[Apollo]

So why would a couple almost 50 year olds who were in a band together for a few years 15 years ago, need counceling from a couple almost 70 year old musicians????? Axl and Slash have moved on with their lives. They were in a band together, they weren't married, they aren't life-time best friends who had a fight. They aren't brothers who had a falling out.

.

They are a couple of guys who were in a band together a long time ago. The same magic and intensity that made them explode is the same thing that made them fall apart. But to be 15 years later and a fan trying to bring them together through counceling.....it borders on getting creepy. We should let two grown men decide what THEY want to do with their lives.

Since it's a crime on MyGNR to like anything but Slaxl, I must insist on any means necessary of resurrecting 1988.

I am on the good side now in the war.

But if Axl and Slash do not want to make music together anymore.....why would anybody think they should get counceling to do so?

[dalsh327]

There's a huge difference between the relationship Mick and Keith had from the one Slash and Axl had, but the biggest difference is that the Stones kept most of their commitments to touring and were punctual. Mick's too money hungry and thrifty to watch his money get pissed away. When Keith was out of commission in the mid 70s, Ron Wood was center stage, and when he "cleaned up", he was back out front.

Had Axl and Slash compromised in the mid 90s, and did something in between Snakepit and Chinese Democracy, and if Izzy had come back just to write songs, they would prob. never have broken up. That's the problem with a lot of bands, when you have 3 or 4 people writing songs, and you get those songs rejected, you're going to harbor resentment towards them. George Harrison left the band because he had a lot of songs and was tired of getting them rejected, and continued to be treated like the "younger brother".

Besides, Ron Wood was the connection with Slash. Mick and Keith were a year into burying the hatchet, and on "25X5" you just see them talking like no time had passed. They were also tired of doing potshots at each other in the press, even though that still goes on.

Mick just sings the songs Keith writes, but he loves dance music, and it's evident on his solo stuff. He's also dismissed a lot of what he's done in the Stones. Even o

[Vincent Vega]

There's a huge difference between the relationship Mick and Keith had from the one Slash and Axl had, but the biggest difference is that the Stones kept most of their commitments to touring and were punctual. Mick's too money hungry and thrifty to watch his money get pissed away. When Keith was out of commission in the mid 70s, Ron Wood was center stage, and when he "cleaned up", he was back out front.

Had Axl and Slash compromised in the mid 90s, and did something in between Snakepit and Chinese Democracy, and if Izzy had come back just to write songs, they would prob. never have broken up. That's the problem with a lot of bands, when you have 3 or 4 people writing songs, and you get those songs rejected, you're going to harbor resentment towards them. George Harrison left the band because he had a lot of songs and was tired of getting them rejected, and continued to be treated like the "younger brother".

Besides, Ron Wood was the connection with Slash. Mick and Keith were a year into burying the hatchet, and on "25X5" you just see them talking like no time had passed. They were also tired of doing potshots at each other in the press, even though that still goes on.

Mick just sings the songs Keith writes, but he loves dance music, and it's evident on his solo stuff. He's also dismissed a lot of what he's done in the Stones. Even o

Izzy did actually come back, he rejoined to write around April 1995 and was still working with them as of around July. Duff had called him because he felt Guns needed help and he and Izzy wrote about ten songs in the space of a week together, one of which that "Down by the Ocean" track Axl mentioned. It dates back to those 1995 sessions.