Alan Niven responds to Randy Lahey's "heart to heart" comment on MYGNR

[alfierose]

Interesting. I wonder what axl does to be so intimidating. So that's why the band never confronted him about being late or how they agreed with things he wanted even if they didn't really like it.

So izzy's on good terms with both alan and axl. But when he says arranged meeting sounds formal. Like other people were involved and axl knew it was gonna be about the HOF.

I think he is just confrontational. People who are passive and will do anything to avoid a scene often can't deal with people who are like that.

It's interesting that David Geffen gets a bit of a free pass from him for not dissimilar behaviour. I bet if Axl had started sending cars as gifts then burning them it wouldn't be seen as cool.

I think a lot of his issues with Axl stem from a 'who's top dog' mentality. He accepts Geffens behaviour because he accepts that David is higher in the food chain. As Manager he probably saw himself as above Axl. I don't think Axl saw it that way!

[wasted]

Did Al say why Axl was late?

[Axl's Bandanna]

There could have been numerous reasons, which were completely harmless why axl never met with izzy, perhaps izzy was made aware before he turned up wherever it was? I'm sure if Axl let izzy down, then Axl would have made up for it some how.

I know I'm pro axl but it couldn't have offended izzy that badly for him to still play in europe and vages with the band after this event.

That photo of Axl and Izzy with Sasha in that club says a lot about the power dynamic in their relationship. Which is prob how Axl wants it.

What photo?

This one (can't find a better quality version right now):

http://t1.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcQwLA26pOoc9G_CXD5Ss3SwG-sapRwVD9Di2aSa4izzDyGOxkZM

I always thought that was the clipper/boat that he travelled to and from the show? I could be wrong though.

Yes it is - it's the boat to the O2 in London.

[useyorappetite]

Just watched parts of the interview with my crappy internet connection and that's a lot of minutes of my life i'm not getting back.

first he said everyone wanted to tour including axl and he didn't know what axl was talking about when he said they didn't care about his well being then said there was a doubt in every one's mind that axl would do the tour.

just like his answer to randy's question he just gave us some bones to chew but didn't really gave a clear answer about anything. So if you had a heart to heart with did you knew about his problems or not?!

And no i don't believe he fired you just because you told him he was a prick.

[Daedalus]

Axl was responding Nivens interviews he did a few years ago. Around time of slsh book.

People definitely interested in these anecdotes. I think Axl has been to right to keep the control of band and not let them be just puppets to some managers. As weve seen from CD they barely need management to sell some records n tour.

I believe those interviews were in response to what Axl said In his chats and/or other interviews. I recall in one interview Alan saying " I have a right to defend myself against this Guy".

Edi found the interview, Niven was responding to shit Axl said about him:

http://www.classicrockmagazine.com/news/exclusive-former-gnr-manager-counters-axls-claims/

I have this interview in .pdf if you need it...

[dalsh327]

Interesting. I wonder what axl does to be so intimidating. So that's why the band never confronted him about being late or how they agreed with things he wanted even if they didn't really like it. So izzy's on good terms with both alan and axl. But when he says arranged meeting sounds formal. Like other people were involved and axl knew it was gonna be about the HOF.

I agree that Axl knew what the meeting was about, a way to get Slash and Axl in the same room, and Izzy was brought in to try to be one of the middlemen.

[wasted]

Axl in the chats was responding to 20 years of shit talking and law suits and basically said nothing.

[useyorappetite]

frome the interview posted above:

here's what axl said about the negotiation:

He added: “As I had stopped speaking with him he sensed his days were numbered and was bending any ear he could along with attempting to sell our renegotiation [with record company Geffen] out for a personal pay day”.

here's what alan siad:

Niven claims that he had “a 17% commission in perpetuity [ie that] anything released, mastered or negotiated during the term of my contract was commissionable forever… Axl fired me in ’91. Now that means that the sales of Appetite, Lies and Use Your Illusions were all commissionable. Forever. To get Axl out of my life I sold those rights back to the band for $3.5 million. I did not want to deal with him again. Now that’s a decent chunk of change, but Geffen had only paid royalties on about five million albums total at that time. Imagine how much I had still coming. [Appetite For Destruction alone has sold 30 million copies.] The settlement I took is not nearly anywhere close to what I was due and had earned.”

my english is failing me. does that mean alan got 17% of everything GNR sold?

[Carne_asaDA]

frome the interview posted above:

here's what axl said about the negotiation:

He added: “As I had stopped speaking with him he sensed his days were numbered and was bending any ear he could along with attempting to sell our renegotiation [with record company Geffen] out for a personal pay day”.

here's what alan siad:

Niven claims that he had “a 17% commission in perpetuity [ie that] anything released, mastered or negotiated during the term of my contract was commissionable forever… Axl fired me in ’91. Now that means that the sales of Appetite, Lies and Use Your Illusions were all commissionable. Forever. To get Axl out of my life I sold those rights back to the band for $3.5 million. I did not want to deal with him again. Now that’s a decent chunk of change, but Geffen had only paid royalties on about five million albums total at that time. Imagine how much I had still coming. [Appetite For Destruction alone has sold 30 million copies.] The settlement I took is not nearly anywhere close to what I was due and had earned.”

my english is failing me. does that mean alan got 17% of everything GNR sold?

He got 17% of everything GnR sold from releases prior to 1991 when he was fired. That means he got paid for AFD, LIES, and UYI but not SI since SI was released in 93.

[classicrawker]

Just watched parts of the interview with my crappy internet connection and that's a lot of minutes of my life i'm not getting back.

first he said everyone wanted to tour including axl and he didn't know what axl was talking about when he said they didn't care about his well being then said there was a doubt in every one's mind that axl would do the tour.

just like his answer to randy's question he just gave us some bones to chew but didn't really gave a clear answer about anything. So if you had a heart to heart with did you knew about his problems or not?!

And no i don't believe he fired you just because you told him he was a prick.

Axl got a record company person fired during the ChiDem sessions for suggesting he start adding lyrics to the music so it is not out of the realm of possibility but I doubt that was the only reason Axl wanted Alan Niven gone...........

[classicrawker]

Just finished part 2 and some of part 3 and these interviews are outstanding.

Cudos to the guys who do the podcast and who arranged them and thanks to Alan Niven for taking the time to share his memories..

Mr. Niven you really need to write a book about your life....really brilliant stuff...........

[wasted]

Just watched parts of the interview with my crappy internet connection and that's a lot of minutes of my life i'm not getting back.

first he said everyone wanted to tour including axl and he didn't know what axl was talking about when he said they didn't care about his well being then said there was a doubt in every one's mind that axl would do the tour.

just like his answer to randy's question he just gave us some bones to chew but didn't really gave a clear answer about anything. So if you had a heart to heart with did you knew about his problems or not?!

And no i don't believe he fired you just because you told him he was a prick.

As I understand it Niven tried to get the band to fire Axl. And from this interview that doesnt seem unlikely. Niven loves the guys in the band, especially Izzy and seeing he was dealing with the business side Axl was the problem. Niv prob thought they could do it without Axl. Axl was probably trying to use whatever he could to hold on to the band. With limited means, all he could be is unknowable, unpredictable. Whereas niven got 17 percent of all these record sales which Axl and band had made. I think band got sig less split between 5?

[wasted]

They didnt have a heart to heart. Its more like why dont you get on stage on time, the questioned his artistic integrity. Axl is painted as a prima donna asshole when he had real problems. Where was the empathy? saying you have empathy but then saying everyone has problems bro get on stage isnt really much help. Knowing Axl has stage fright then not really taking it into account and just using as leverage to control the band to make it easy to haul in the 17 percent.

Niven - find problem, isolate and try to eject it.

Dougie - deal with the problem, well you know try to

Not that Niven is wrong in the rational in final analysis. But do you make tne lead singers life easier or harder. Aerosmith managers treated Tyler like a prize thoroughbred. Pamper them keep them running smooth. Protect them from things. Not hang them out to dry and push them to point of riots.

Things run smooth now bcos no one is pressuring Axl into being on time. Or tring to wrestle control from Axl. For as much of Axls life that has been taken by GNR he deserves some control in it. It really is a classic case of the industry or business side being really arrogant. But in this case they met someone who was willing to fight them. Of course they would say hes crazy. Why not just take the money. Thats what they are doing. They nego huge deals for themselves then say not in it for the money. If your not in it for the money why are you bcos these guys arent creative geniouses. If they were theyd be in a band getting ripped off by labels!

Edited March 18, 2013 by wasted

[AndreCC]

Wish we could have a part 4 and 5. I'm sure there's a lot more to tell! And Alan Niven is very good at telling stories. It's entertaining! He should write a book!

[alfierose]

As I've mentioned in another post I think Niven and Axl have some traits in common which might account for some of the clashing.

He kept mentioning about not being in it for the money and how his was owed by both GNR and GW, this surprises me because I would expect a good business manager to be about the money to some extent. If you can't keep your own house in order how can you inspire confidence in others? There is a balance of course between greed and integrity but to insist you don't care about the money, make grand sacrifices but then keep bringing it up 20+ years later just seems odd. Clinging on to grievances is something him and Axl do have in common.

[useyorappetite]

frome the interview posted above:

here's what axl said about the negotiation:

He added: “As I had stopped speaking with him he sensed his days were numbered and was bending any ear he could along with attempting to sell our renegotiation [with record company Geffen] out for a personal pay day”.

here's what alan siad:

Niven claims that he had “a 17% commission in perpetuity [ie that] anything released, mastered or negotiated during the term of my contract was commissionable forever… Axl fired me in ’91. Now that means that the sales of Appetite, Lies and Use Your Illusions were all commissionable. Forever. To get Axl out of my life I sold those rights back to the band for $3.5 million. I did not want to deal with him again. Now that’s a decent chunk of change, but Geffen had only paid royalties on about five million albums total at that time. Imagine how much I had still coming. [Appetite For Destruction alone has sold 30 million copies.] The settlement I took is not nearly anywhere close to what I was due and had earned.”

my english is failing me. does that mean alan got 17% of everything GNR sold?

He got 17% of everything GnR sold from releases prior to 1991 when he was fired. That means he got paid for AFD, LIES, and UYI but not SI since SI was released in 93.

That's why i thought i understood wrong. 17% ?? that's alot for a manager! Good thing the band bought it!

But is that what axl meant when he said he tied to sell our renegotiation? did the band still got something or when allen said they got 30% after the renegotiation it was after they bought it from alan?

Not in it for money my ass. That was part of what irritated me. How he went on and on that he wasn't in it for money but that's all dough wanted! he was better for gnr than dough but come on why else would you do this job.

[classicrawker]

frome the interview posted above:

here's what axl said about the negotiation:

He added: “As I had stopped speaking with him he sensed his days were numbered and was bending any ear he could along with attempting to sell our renegotiation [with record company Geffen] out for a personal pay day”.

here's what alan siad:

Niven claims that he had “a 17% commission in perpetuity [ie that] anything released, mastered or negotiated during the term of my contract was commissionable forever… Axl fired me in ’91. Now that means that the sales of Appetite, Lies and Use Your Illusions were all commissionable. Forever. To get Axl out of my life I sold those rights back to the band for $3.5 million. I did not want to deal with him again. Now that’s a decent chunk of change, but Geffen had only paid royalties on about five million albums total at that time. Imagine how much I had still coming. [Appetite For Destruction alone has sold 30 million copies.] The settlement I took is not nearly anywhere close to what I was due and had earned.”

my english is failing me. does that mean alan got 17% of everything GNR sold?

He got 17% of everything GnR sold from releases prior to 1991 when he was fired. That means he got paid for AFD, LIES, and UYI but not SI since SI was released in 93.

That's why i thought i understood wrong. 17% ?? that's alot for a manager! Good thing the band bought it!

But is that what axl meant when he said he tied to sell our renegotiation? did the band still got something or when allen said they got 30% after the renegotiation it was after they bought it from alan?

Not in it for money my ass. That was part of what irritated me. How he went on and on that he wasn't in it for money but that's all dough wanted! he was better for gnr than dough but come on why else would you do this job.

17% is not an excessive amount for an Agent to make mate....Did you listen to the interviews? Niven worked his ass off for the band and got Geffen to renegotiate their record contract before the release of the UYI albums to one of the most favorable contracts in the business.

Do you realize Tom Zutaut could not find anyone willing to manage the band initially because they were such a trainwreck? Alan took a pretty big gamble managing Guns in the early days as he could have played it safe with Big White who were doing well back then.

He also claims he worked without pay initially so I think he was being sincere when he says he did not do it for the money...he earned every penny he was paid.........

Edited March 18, 2013 by classicrawker

[Carne_asaDA]

People don't realize, artists don't get paid much from album sales. You'd be surpised to find out what percentage the artists gets from album sales alone. The most of their income comes from touring, merch, etc. 17% of album sales was decent all things considered. But in the grand scheme of things, Alan was underpaid.

[Village Gorilla Head]

Just to chip in on the Hall of Fame thing:

Izzy could well have expressed initial thoughts regarding not attending the event, and could even have declined his invite.

But, if he decided to reconsider - if Axl came along that is - he may well have organised a meeting.

I've no doubt that organisers would manage to fit Izzy and Axl in, even if it was a last minute decision, and Izzy would have known that.

[gnrfan2007]

Izzy traveled to LA and Axl didn't have the courtesy to show up to a pre-arranged meeting? What a cock.

How many times has Izzy quit on GnR?

Marc Canter described Izzy as a PARANOID crack head who was afraid of losing all of his money. Izzy quit GnR to protect his financial wealth because he knew he was a trainwreck and he knew GnR was a trainwreck ... one lawsuit or drug-overdose away from losing everything.

How many people have contested to Izzy being an UNRELIABLE person you could not count on. Where do you think this phrase came about: WHERE IS IZZY? Because nobody ever knows where Izzy is!

But yet, folks like you hold Axl to a much higher standard than you do Izzy or any other former classic members? Axl bails on Izzy this one time, compared to the numerous times Izzy bailed on him and GnR, and you get all butt-hurt ... blaming Axl?! LOL

You should take everything bitter old man Alan Niven says ... with a grain of salt. The guy did have a psychological breakdown himself you know. And who knows how much financial problems he has now too. If I was in his position, I too would love to be getting my life-time royalties from the AFD and UYIs era.

The way Alan Niven describes it, it sounds like it was some big pre-arranged business meeting between Izzy and Axl. When does Izzy and Axl do "pre-arranged" business meetings with each other? LOL

It was more likely just a buddy call. Izzy probably just called up Axl and said he was going to be in L.A. and they should meet to discuss what to do about the RRnHOF because everybody is pestering him about it.

When has Izzy or anybody else ever changed Axl's mind? I truly doubt Izzy was actually going to try to convince Axl to attend the RRnHOF. So I really doubt Alan Niven's assertion that the purpose of the meeting was for Izzy to try to convince Axl to do something he didn't want to do.

Izzy more likely just wanted to know what Axl was going to do because the RRnHOF and the ex-members needed an answer from him too.

Izzy probably already decided that if Axl didn't attend, he too would not attend. So he needed to get a clear answer from Axl.

So Axl probably called Izzy with his final decision instead of having to do a "meeting".

I mean, how many times has Izzy jammed with GnR on tour before RRnHOF? Did they really need to meet face-to-face when they have jammed and hung out with each other countless times prior to the RRnHOF?

So Alan Niven is trying to make it seem like this supposed meeting between Axl and Izzy to discuss the RRnHOF was some big event in GnR history.

Given that Izzy is happily still jamming with GnR on tour, clearly indicates whatever supposed meeting they had "pre-arranged" prior to the RRnHOF was really all about NOTHING!

Edited March 19, 2013 by gnrfan2007

[wasted]

It was really Niven trying to get Axl fired. I dont see why he under values Axl so much. Ok after AFD has sold a ton maybe they could....I just dont see how the band could be GNR without Axl. For all the problems that was an element of GNR. Without Axl it just isnt happen whether in clubs or stadiums.

[dalsh327]

I

Izzy traveled to LA and Axl didn't have the courtesy to show up to a pre-arranged meeting? What a cock.

How many times has Izzy quit on GnR?

Marc Canter described Izzy as a PARANOID crack head who was afraid of losing all of his money. Izzy quit GnR to protect his financial wealth because he knew he was a trainwreck and he knew GnR was a trainwreck ... one lawsuit or drug-overdose away from losing everything.

How many people have contested to Izzy being an UNRELIABLE person you could not count on. Where do you think this phrase came about: WHERE IS IZZY? Because nobody ever knows where Izzy is!

But yet, folks like you hold Axl to a much higher standard than you do Izzy or any other former classic members? Axl bails on Izzy this one time, compared to the numerous times Izzy bailed on him and GnR, and you get all butt-hurt ... blaming Axl?! LOL

You should take everything bitter old man Alan Niven says ... with a grain of salt. The guy did have a psychological breakdown himself you know. And who knows how much financial problems he has now too. If I was in his position, I too would love to be getting my life-time royalties from the AFD and UYIs era.

The way Alan Niven describes it, it sounds like it was some big pre-arranged business meeting between Izzy and Axl. When does Izzy and Axl do "pre-arranged" business meetings with each other? LOL

It was more likely just a buddy call. Izzy probably just called up Axl and said he was going to be in L.A. and they should meet to discuss what to do about the RRnHOF because everybody is pestering him about it.

When has Izzy or anybody else ever changed Axl's mind? I truly doubt Izzy was actually going to try to convince Axl to attend the RRnHOF. So I really doubt Alan Niven's assertion that the purpose of the meeting was for Izzy to try to convince Axl to do something he didn't want to do.

Izzy more likely just wanted to know what Axl was going to do because the RRnHOF and the ex-members needed an answer from him too.

Izzy probably already decided that if Axl didn't attend, he too would not attend. So he needed to get a clear answer from Axl.

So Axl probably called Izzy with his final decision instead of having to do a "meeting".

I mean, how many times has Izzy jammed with GnR on tour before RRnHOF? Did they really need to meet face-to-face when they have jammed and hung out with each other countless times prior to the RRnHOF?

So Alan Niven is trying to make it seem like this supposed meeting between Axl and Izzy to discuss the RRnHOF was some big event in GnR history.

Given that Izzy is happily still jamming with GnR on tour, clearly indicates whatever supposed meeting they had "pre-arranged" prior to the RRnHOF was really all about NOTHING!

I'm sure someone thought Izzy would be the key to bringing Axl and Slash in the same room. Who would set up that meeting? Don't know. It just came across that Alan still keeps in touch with Izzy.

I think most of us don't think the Rock Hall is a big deal, we're just happy for those who are inducted and acknowledged.

When the announcement was made, the only things Axl was thinking about was getting Azoff out of his life and saving face from the Rock in Rio webcast, 2 reasons why he prob. went on That Metal Show.

I don't think Izzy was keen on spending that much money to go to it. I think if the AFD lineup was going to do a song, he would've gone,

[Lim666]

so there we have the info that even Izzy would have been ok with attending the HOF induction, but only if "all" AFD members would have gone to.

so it was just and only Axl again blewing this. what a bitter man Axl still is......wasnt it "time to move on" by his own words?

[Sigh]

I'm not sure if I buy that Izzy was trying to talk Axl into attending the HOF. How would Alan Niven know this? Furthermore, Duff was skeptical in an interview with RS that Izzy would even attend, and Matt Sorum said he heard from Slash that Izzy wasn't attending before Axl, and subsequently Izzy, made their announcements regarding the HOF.

Also, all due respect to Alan Niven, but he comes off as bitter towards Axl (see the comment, "then again, how sweet is Sweet Child. Or Rocket Queen. That is Axl as an angel. Maybe even a bi-sexual one"), and perhaps rightfully so. Regardless, he is only speaking his side of things, so there are sides/factors to consider.

Ali

The other inductees were aware from the beginning that Izzy was not attending and it had nothing to do with Axl. All due respect to Mr. Niven if Izzy was meeting with Axl it was not about the HOF. And I agree with Ali about the comments from Mr. Niven implying Axl's bisexuality. He has been the only past insider that has ever made statements implying this. If it was remotely true it would have been media fodder long ago.

People change their minds. Perhaps Izzy thought it would be cool to go to the RRHOF and called Rose and asked to meet to discuss it. Considering the close relationship between Izzy and Alan Niven, I suspect Niven knows more about it than anyone other that Izzy and Axl.

[Sigh]

Izzy traveled to LA and Axl didn't have the courtesy to show up to a pre-arranged meeting? What a cock.

How many times has Izzy quit on GnR?

Marc Canter described Izzy as a PARANOID crack head who was afraid of losing all of his money. Izzy quit GnR to protect his financial wealth because he knew he was a trainwreck and he knew GnR was a trainwreck ... one lawsuit or drug-overdose away from losing everything.

How many people have contested to Izzy being an UNRELIABLE person you could not count on. Where do you think this phrase came about: WHERE IS IZZY? Because nobody ever knows where Izzy is!

But yet, folks like you hold Axl to a much higher standard than you do Izzy or any other former classic members? Axl bails on Izzy this one time, compared to the numerous times Izzy bailed on him and GnR, and you get all butt-hurt ... blaming Axl?! LOL

You should take everything bitter old man Alan Niven says ... with a grain of salt. The guy did have a psychological breakdown himself you know. And who knows how much financial problems he has now too. If I was in his position, I too would love to be getting my life-time royalties from the AFD and UYIs era.

The way Alan Niven describes it, it sounds like it was some big pre-arranged business meeting between Izzy and Axl. When does Izzy and Axl do "pre-arranged" business meetings with each other? LOL

It was more likely just a buddy call. Izzy probably just called up Axl and said he was going to be in L.A. and they should meet to discuss what to do about the RRnHOF because everybody is pestering him about it.

When has Izzy or anybody else ever changed Axl's mind? I truly doubt Izzy was actually going to try to convince Axl to attend the RRnHOF. So I really doubt Alan Niven's assertion that the purpose of the meeting was for Izzy to try to convince Axl to do something he didn't want to do.

Izzy more likely just wanted to know what Axl was going to do because the RRnHOF and the ex-members needed an answer from him too.

Izzy probably already decided that if Axl didn't attend, he too would not attend. So he needed to get a clear answer from Axl.

So Axl probably called Izzy with his final decision instead of having to do a "meeting".

I mean, how many times has Izzy jammed with GnR on tour before RRnHOF? Did they really need to meet face-to-face when they have jammed and hung out with each other countless times prior to the RRnHOF?

So Alan Niven is trying to make it seem like this supposed meeting between Axl and Izzy to discuss the RRnHOF was some big event in GnR history.

Given that Izzy is happily still jamming with GnR on tour, clearly indicates whatever supposed meeting they had "pre-arranged" prior to the RRnHOF was really all about NOTHING!

Lets talk about reliability for a bit.

When Rose no showed the Long Beach show, Izzy was there.

When Rose no showed the Phoenix concert, Izzy was there.

When Rose dove into the crowd in St. Louis, Izzy was there.

When Rose decided it would be cool to make everyone, including the band, sit around and wait on him, Izzy was there waiting on him.

When Rose no showed that concert in Europe (I forget the city...Rose was apparently in a different country at show time, Izzy was there.

When Rose left the stage early and the promoters had to lock the band in the venue, Izzy was there (but not for long)

When Rose tried to demote Izzy, Izzy was there.

But he did miss the fifteen plus years it took for Rose to produce a solo album under the name Izzy helped build.