downzy Posted September 27, 2013 Share Posted September 27, 2013 Jesse is a rat and Hank and Brocks mom are dead because if him.But it's not really because he ratted that they're dead. It's because he's an idiot who saw more than what was really there. Had he just sat down with Walt on the bench none of this would have happened. It's also funny to think that had Huell not lifted the weed from Jesse's pocket none of this would have happened either. Jesse's major character flaw is that he can be easily manipulated, even when no one is trying to manipulate him. He's the antithesis of Heisenberg in that he has a hard time seeing the realities of the situation and understanding how things will play out. In that way they're another great example of the odd couple. Heisenberg channels his emotion to achieve the results he wants (fear drives him forward, whereas it drove Walt back). Jesse simply acts on impulse. The one time he tries to out Heisenberg Walt results in everything going to shit. While I do have a certain level of sympathy for what has happened to Jesse, it's tempered by the fact that most of it is his doing by being so easily manipulated. How can he see the "realities of a situation" - When Walt never tells him the truth?Never a Jesse fanboy, but i'm not mad at him.I meant he has no orientation for what's happening. He can't assess or gauge a situation whether he's being manipulated or not. Walt was far more successful at outsmarting those who tried to manipulate him. I'm not mad at him either - I don't get the hate many have for him because he turned on Walt. But let's not pretend that shit didn't hit the fan until Jesse started to play the game that Walt had, up until this point, played so well. Throughout the entire show Walt has tried to protect Jesse from others and from himself (though I'm not forgetting that most of that was motivated for selfish reasons). Once Jesse had rejected that protection and turned on Walt (without having the mental capacity to adequately do so), things went to shit. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gia Posted September 27, 2013 Share Posted September 27, 2013 Jesse's a bitch, bitch!QFTJesse is gonna live (my prediction)but I think the little rat should be exterminated Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MrPoe Posted September 27, 2013 Share Posted September 27, 2013 I wonder if the end scene is Walt meeting Skyler in a diner with Holly, while Flynn tries to parallel park outside, and Journey starts playing... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Forsaken Posted September 27, 2013 Share Posted September 27, 2013 What if...... the ricin was for Holly. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ace Nova Posted September 27, 2013 Share Posted September 27, 2013 What if...... the ricin was for Holly. What would make you even think that? (I'm pretty sure you're joking ) 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
izzygirl Posted September 28, 2013 Share Posted September 28, 2013 Hey, how pissed would you guys be, on a level from 1 to 10, being 1 not caring at all and 10 throwing the remote at the TV and suing Vince Gilligan, if in the end, they showed Jesse waking up from a very awkward dream at Walter's class?11. Going all Heisemberg on Vince Gilligan. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bacardimayne Posted September 28, 2013 Share Posted September 28, 2013 Less than 48 hours Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CheapJon Posted September 28, 2013 Share Posted September 28, 2013 I wonder if the end scene is Walt meeting Skyler in a diner with Holly, while Flynn tries to parallel park outside, and Journey starts playing...and it all goes to black when flynn is entering the diner. it would be the greatest homage of all time. but so bad for the series. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
luciusfunk Posted September 28, 2013 Share Posted September 28, 2013 Pretty long, but worth reading. I didn't come up with this. When I entered season 5 of Breaking Bad, I expected a Shakespearean tragedy, specifically Hamlet. I thought we would see one character left alive to witness and abhor the carnage left in the wake of a dead Walter White. As we approach the final episode I look more to the classics and the Homeric epic The Odyssey due to Walter's Nostos (Greek for homecoming). When Tennyson wrote the final lines of the poem Ulysses, he carefully constructed a finish to please both latin and classical critics. The Romans hated Odysseus. He was sly, clever, cunning, tricky, and in some ways unethical in that he did whatever it took to win. He lost his men making him a bad leader, he lost his ships and spoils of war, and most importantly he cheated the moral codes of war to win against Troy who really should have won in the minds of the Romans. The Romans believed (and supported Virgil's Aenead by its popularity) that the Trojans were an old civilization devoted to family, the gods, and honor. Odysseus and the Achaeans disobeyed the gods and defied their orders. He shook his fist at Polyphemus and declared his name from previous statements of "nobody." Tennyson's poem ends, "Made weak by time and fate, but strong in will, To strive, to seek, and not to yield." Many English critics believe the final infinitive "to yield" contains two meanings. Yield in one sense can mean "to stop" but it can also mean "to produce" as in field's harvest yield. In this way, the poem concedes to latinist and Classical thought at the same time by placing honor upon a man who has the ambition to not stop over the ambition to acquire and amass.Walter White is Odysseus returning home for his Nostos (Homecoming in Greek). Nostos does not mean victory. In The Odyssey, Odysseus loses everything before he realizes he should not and cannot anger the gods any more. He loses his men, spoils, and ships. He passes through hell and witnesses the cautionary tales of warriors who have died before him before he comes out the other side a changed man willing to acquiesce as his desire to return home reaches a fever pitch. Odysseus returns a cloaked beggar, only welcomed by an old servant from his fields and recognized by his old dog Argos (Jesse Pinkman). Once Odysseus sees his trusted companion, the dog is dying in its own filth, literally sleeping in its shit, and passes away knowing its master has returned. Odysseus returns to rid his house of suitors (Todd&company invading his home) and restore his name to the shambled palace/kingdom of Ithaca (destroyed house). His son Telemachus doesn't know his true nature as a crafty and sly warrior willing to win at all costs. He doesn't know his father's bravery or cunning. Walt has returned from his journey for simply his homecoming. His son and wife have changed their names, Gray Matters has taken his name from their equation.The season quote is "Remember My Name" and also uses Shelley's "Ozymandias" as a pre-teaser. Tennyson's "Ulysses" best captures this moment of personal triumph by combining that final line of " and not to Yield" in the meaning of Walt's never stopping but also that not stopping is more important that amassing or producing. Walt began this season with $100 left in his wallet. He willingly discards what he has gained, the barrel of money, his material goods, so on and so forth in order to strive and not yield unto death a defeated man. Walt's thirst for greatness is greater than any wealth or power he could amass. Like Odysseus returning and doing as Athena tells him to do, Walt understands his final desires and duties. He must return home to take back his kingdom before his name is snuffed out from the history books. His goal it to try, to not yield, but not necessarily to claim victory. He is concerned with dying as he believes he should, not holed up in a cabin (a prison on its own) with useless and valueless money (inflation of 10,000 for an hour visitor). He would rather die fighting with nothing than give up holding on to what he has left of his amassed wealth. I end here. Perhaps Gilligan is mixing the two (Hamlet & The Odyssey). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ManetsBR Posted September 28, 2013 Author Share Posted September 28, 2013 Good read. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bacardimayne Posted September 28, 2013 Share Posted September 28, 2013 Just rewatched the episode for the 4th time and god, do I ever hope I'm wrong about Gretchen and Elliot not playing a part in the next episode. I want them dead. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ManetsBR Posted September 28, 2013 Author Share Posted September 28, 2013 Agreed. I've seen the episode just once, but I rewatched that Gray Matters bit at least some 5 times. I really want them dead. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gia Posted September 28, 2013 Share Posted September 28, 2013 Didn't he sell his stock because of his fallout with the Gretchen? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ManetsBR Posted September 28, 2013 Author Share Posted September 28, 2013 I think so. Why? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gia Posted September 28, 2013 Share Posted September 28, 2013 I think so. Why?No just wondering.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Powerage5 Posted September 28, 2013 Share Posted September 28, 2013 So guys, is it safe to go back and read the spoiler thread now? Y'know, for teh lol's? Is there anything in there that could possibly come true at this point? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
luciusfunk Posted September 28, 2013 Share Posted September 28, 2013 I seriously doubt it. I think the finale had Chileans killing Walt's family as revenge for Gus's death. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Powerage5 Posted September 28, 2013 Share Posted September 28, 2013 I seriously doubt it. I think the finale had Chileans killing Walt's family as revenge for Gus's death.Yeah...not happening Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
luciusfunk Posted September 28, 2013 Share Posted September 28, 2013 (edited) Yeah. The Chileans kill Marie and Jr and take Hank and Holly hostage demanding Walt show himself. Walt frees Jesse from the super lab where he's cooking for the Czechs. Walt storms into Hank's house killing all the Chileans. Hank is shot by the leader as Walt shoots him. Jesse saves Holly and raises her while Walt shoots himself. The ricin was for Ted. Edited September 28, 2013 by luciusfunk Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Forsaken Posted September 29, 2013 Share Posted September 29, 2013 That would have been total shit. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ace Nova Posted September 29, 2013 Share Posted September 29, 2013 So guys, is it safe to go back and read the spoiler thread now? Y'know, for teh lol's? Is there anything in there that could possibly come true at this point?Feel free - they're almost a completely different show/plot/theme, etc. by this point. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
luciusfunk Posted September 29, 2013 Share Posted September 29, 2013 Looks like a lot of people on reddit want/expect Marie to kill herself in the next episode, possibly the cold opening. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
axlslash Posted September 29, 2013 Share Posted September 29, 2013 So the speculation about Skyler being the dead a-la the bacon at Dennys must be wrong, yes?Same with the last name being Marie's maiden name?why must that be wrong? There are no "musts" in Breaking Bad. Only one way to find out. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Izzy_Stradlin_XX Posted September 29, 2013 Share Posted September 29, 2013 Anybody know a good live stream? I really wanna watch the show at the same time as you guys. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Powerage5 Posted September 29, 2013 Share Posted September 29, 2013 So guys, is it safe to go back and read the spoiler thread now? Y'know, for teh lol's? Is there anything in there that could possibly come true at this point?Feel free - they're almost a completely different show/plot/theme, etc. by this point.Read through it. The leaks were hilariously wrong, as were most of our own predictions Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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