Nearly 1 In 5 Millennials Consider Joseph Stalin And Kim Jong Un ‘Heroes’

[Chewbacca]

 

If you want to prove something you gotta give some data or any kind of info that proves you right

1 minute ago, soon said:

Ive gotta hand it to you for your boldness:  you have boldly stated that you will use anecdotal evidence and I must use stats.

The USA aint sending its citizens to a banned country, risking they become spies or saboteurs, for a program that isn't seeing positive results.  

Now, THAT's pure speculation. This study-medicine-in-Cuba program is not for the US only. Many people do it here in Brazil and they still gotta adapt to practice it here.

[Ace Nova]

43 minutes ago, SoulMonster said:

Hehe, so the tourists who can afford to vacation in Florida are doing well? 

I would assume so....  Disney vacations can be pricey for a family coming from overseas.  I think the average family spends upwards of $5k.  Maybe not as much as more exotic destinations but they are here on vacation, spending money so I'd assume they're doing ok. lol.

[Ace Nova]

1 hour ago, Chewbacca said:

Actually we're in the middle of a shitstorm. I'm a surgeon here and the hospital I'm working on is closing its door, just like 3 others on the same area. The healthcare system is done for. We can't medicate our patients cuz we can't afford basic medications. We are doing bandages using diapers and crepe tape cuz we can't afford gauzes and micropore tape. We can't perform any surgical procedures because our anesthesiologists quit. Their payment is overdue eleven months. Mine is overdue seven months. Rats and cockroaches infest the halls and corridors, health surveillance closed the kitchen and patients are being served fast food. This "free" health care system myth is just so stupid. somebody will always pay for it. If Obamacare was really based on our SUS, all I can I say is good fuckin luck and hold on tight to your health insurance.

Wow, that sounds horrible.  I wouldn't have known based on the tourism here but that doesn't sound good at all.

[soon]

10 minutes ago, Chewbacca said:

 

If you want to prove something you gotta give some data or any kind of info that proves you right

Now, THAT's pure speculation. This study-medicine-in-Cuba program is not for the US only. Many people do it here in Brazil and they still gotta adapt to practice it here.

Im trying to be polite:  YOU have offered no evidence!!!!  

(I never said it was only for USA - as the links I included clearly state)

[Chewbacca]

4 minutes ago, Kasanova King said:

Wow, that sounds horrible.  I wouldn't have known based on the tourism here but that doesn't sound good at all.

Here, have some pics:

http://www.sindisaude.org.br/noticia/beneficencia-inspecao-dos-vereadores-no-hospital-define-reuniao-em-novembro

 

This here, kids, is what happens when you have a center left government for 20 years

It is in portuguese, of course. It basically says how bad things are, how the kitchen was closed, how 100 people were fired...

These photos are not part of the worst you can find there.

[Chewbacca]

7 minutes ago, soon said:

Im trying to be polite:  YOU have offered no evidence!!!!  

(I never said it was only for USA - as the links I included clearly state)

What evidence do I have to give you? I'm stating a fact: you can't practice medicine in US with just the cuban grad, you need to go thru the steps, just like anyone with a foreign grad. I'm the one asking for any proof that cuban grads can perform as good as their american peers or that the US government was holding this program back for fears of domestic spies and saboteurs.

 

You want evidence of cuban docs fleeing from their duties with cuba?

http://g1.globo.com/sp/bauru-marilia/noticia/2016/08/cubano-abandona-mais-medicos-e-deixa-carta-vou-para-os-eua.htm

Here's a guy that fled from Brazil to the US to flee from the cuban government, it is in portuguese, sorry.

Here's another one, in english:

https://www.nytimes.com/2017/09/29/world/americas/brazil-cuban-doctors-revolt.html

 

[soon]

7 minutes ago, Chewbacca said:

What evidence do I have to give you? I'm stating a fact: you can't practice medicine in US with just the cuban grad, you need to go thru the steps, just like anyone with a foreign grad. I'm the one asking for any proof that cuban grads can perform as good as their american peers or that the US government was holding this program back for fears of domestic spies and saboteurs.

 

You want evidence of cuban docs fleeing from their duties with cuba?

http://g1.globo.com/sp/bauru-marilia/noticia/2016/08/cubano-abandona-mais-medicos-e-deixa-carta-vou-para-os-eua.htm

Here's a guy that fled from Brazil to the US to flee from the cuban government, it is in portuguese, sorry.

Here's another one, in english:

https://www.nytimes.com/2017/09/29/world/americas/brazil-cuban-doctors-revolt.html

 

I dont think your understanding what Im saying.

I didn't ask for evidence of Dr fleeing.  You only offered anecdotal evidence that Cuban trained Drs arent good.  Then I gave evidence that says they must be.  

I said that USA was not holding the citizens back despite the risk.

 

[mishan]

10 hours ago, Len Cnut said:

It has not and nor will it.  The precepts of it were quite case specific to a certain day and time.  Now while I do think there is a great deal of value to extract from it, difficult not to really, its come to form some of the language we use when discussing economics and politics, its not a functional or workable theory because it doesn't account for greed, and thats the defining characteristic of the human race.  Greed, wanting to get ahead, no one really wants equality, not like that, it's not natural.

I don't think Marx was an idiot, nor do I think he was evil. And greed isn't the problem, at least not anymore than it is in any other kind of society. The problem, as we have graphically seen, is that when the collective means everything, an individual life means nothing. Hence the hundred million and more dead under communism, you know, for 'pragmatic' reasons. Attempts to bring health, wealth, and happiness to all by governments inevitably lead to totalitarianism. And it will inevitably fail, because life doesn't work like that.

I'm not against social welfare, I don't fancy seeing people die of exposure, starvation, or lack of medical care, we need a social safety net. But even that needs massive redesign.

Communism - not going to help. Not for anyone.

[dontdamnmeuyi2015]

Obviously these people have studied history when it comes to Stalin.

As for Kim maybe they should take a trip to North Korea and live there for a while and see how their people are treated.

The US isn't perfect, but at least you have the freedom of speech without going to jail or being killed. Ask a few people who have been lucky enough to get out of North Korea and lived to tell the tale.

[soon]

State Communism is trash.  However just because Marx and Engels were wrong about some things, doesnt necessarily mean they weren't correct about some things.  

Best to just take their critic of Capitalism and leave their prescriptions.  

If you have weekends off.  Or maybe work weekends but your employer cant force you to work more than 40 hours a week.  If you get holidays.  If your life is in anyways improved by a union.  If you had govt support after an injury or health crisis, If there are health and safety standards keeping you safe at work... thank those two crazies!  

Edited November 8, 2017 by soon

[DieselDaisy]

One other crime of Marx was turning the discipline of history into something incredibly dreary for decade upon decade of British students. History as it was taught in British colleges and universities from the 1960s to the present is full of dreary socio-economic tedium. All the interesting stuff like epic battles, heroes, villains and monarchical bedroom frolics was jettisoned in favour of abstract 'market forces' and capital accumulation. Percentages and aggregates (you basically have to be a mathematician to be a historian these days) replaced chronological dates.

[Chewbacca]

1 hour ago, soon said:

I dont think your understanding what Im saying.

I didn't ask for evidence of Dr fleeing.  You only offered anecdotal evidence that Cuban trained Drs arent good.  Then I gave evidence that says they must be.  

I said that USA was not holding the citizens back despite the risk.

 

Which is...? You thinking that they're good enough based on a very vague assumption that you don't have any statistic for? 

Well, here's a well known collection of Cuban medic mishaps here in Brazil. It is in Portuguese, sorry:

http://www.perito.med.br/p/cubanadas-na-saude-do-brasil.html

Just a few of them. There are a lot of wrong dosages of antibiotics and even one doctor prescribing a banana peel treatment for pneumonia (?). Translate it you will find lots.

[soon]

2 minutes ago, Chewbacca said:

Which is...? You thinking that they're good enough based on a very vague assumption that you don't have any statistic for? 

Well, here's a well known collection of Cuban medic mishaps here in Brazil. It is in Portuguese, sorry:

http://www.perito.med.br/p/cubanadas-na-saude-do-brasil.html

Just a few of them. There are a lot of wrong dosages of antibiotics and even one doctor prescribing a banana peel treatment for pneumonia (?). Translate it you will find lots.

No idea how we got here. You dont have any statistics!  Drs trained in Cuba meet US standards.  They practice in the US.  

[Chewbacca]

Only after an adaptation exam. Otherwise no, they can't.

[SoulMonster]

2 hours ago, Kasanova King said:

I would assume so....  Disney vacations can be pricey for a family coming from overseas.  I think the average family spends upwards of $5k.  Maybe not as much as more exotic destinations but they are here on vacation, spending money so I'd assume they're doing ok. lol.

How about all those who can't vacation in Florida, do you think they are doing better or worse? 

[Chewbacca]

I don't have statistics, but I have shown you many reports of medical wrongdoing which are signed and stamped by cubans.

[Ace Nova]

Just now, SoulMonster said:

How about all those who can't vacation in Florida, do you think they are doing better or worse? 

lol...I have no idea.  Maybe they don't like Florida?  Maybe they are going to more expensive destinations?  Maybe they can't afford to vacation at all?  No idea where you're coming from with that question.  

[SoulMonster]

19 minutes ago, Kasanova King said:

lol...I have no idea.  Maybe they don't like Florida?  Maybe they are going to more expensive destinations?  Maybe they can't afford to vacation at all?  No idea where you're coming from with that question.  

Just slowly getting to the point that an increaed influx of Brazilian tourists could also just mean that the rich are getting richer, it doesn't really say anything about the state of the average Brazilian. And that kinda ties in with my previous point about economic inequality and the widening gap between the have and the have-nots.

How good a country is shouldn't be based on how rich the rich are, but how rich the poor are. At least that's how I am thinking. 

[Graeme]

Aww yeah...

*Disclaimer, I'm a proponent of Nordic-style democratic socialism and think Stalin and Kim Jong-Un are terrible.

[Ace Nova]

3 hours ago, SoulMonster said:

Just slowly getting to the point that an increaed influx of Brazilian tourists could also just mean that the rich are getting richer, it doesn't really say anything about the state of the average Brazilian. And that kinda ties in with my previous point about economic inequality and the widening gap between the have and the have-nots.

How good a country is shouldn't be based on how rich the rich are, but how rich the poor are. At least that's how I am thinking. 

I see your point.  I think if the majority of a country...say the broad middle class...maybe 70%-80% of the population is doing well, then I think the country is doing well.  And obviously the poor should also have (At least) first world living conditions.  

[Georgy Zhukov]

I've always heard about how Communism didn't work, but for a time it did. Before 1917, Russia was a nation of millions of illiterate peasants with the average life expectancy of between of 30. By Stalin's death they were a nation of engineers, scientists, industry, the population doubled. This crash modernization came at a cost but it was a huge step up from what it was before. Party corruption brought the Soviet Union down. It devolved into a plutocracy. Yeltsin's economic reforms were radical and they did not help with the situations. Yeltsin today is probably the most despised Russian leader other than Gorbachev. Stalin is actually one of the most beloved. Stalin and Peter the Great. He is despised in Poland and Ukraine though. 

 

Under Stalin, despite the tragedies, the people prospered. Russians who lived through the 90's depression remember fondly of the old days and those who grew up in the 90's wish to see those days again and they believe Putin is the man to do it. Putin is by far the most powerful Russian leader since Stalin. He is the richest man in the world, though his salary is modest. He makes even less than the US President. But he steals money from the Russian people and oligarchs alike. 

[Georgy Zhukov]

Also, who thinks Kim is a hero? I think a lot of people just admire the fact he called Trump a 'dotard' and Trump hasn't done shit about it. 

[Chris 55]

On 11/7/2017 at 7:33 PM, Kasanova King said:

http://www.foxnews.com/us/2017/11/03/millennials-think-socialism-would-create-great-safe-space-study-finds.html

 

Nearly half of all U.S. millennials believe the greatest safe space of them all would be living under a socialist regime.

That’s according to a new study from research firm YouGov and Washington, D.C.-based Victims of Communism Memorial Foundation, which surveyed over 2,000 people regarding their views on socialism and the communist political system. The biggest takeaway from the study was that one out of every two millennials surveyed said they would rather live in a socialist or communist country over a capitalist democracy like the U.S.

“Millennials now make up the largest generation in America, and we're seeing some deeply worrisome trends," Marion Smith, executive director of the foundation said in a statement to Fox News. "Millennials are increasingly turning away from capitalism and toward socialism and even communism as a viable alternative.”

Nearly 45 percent of millennials polled said that they would prefer to live in a socialist country compared to the 42 percent who said they preferred a capitalist one. Another 7 percent said that the preferred living in a communist country above all. The findings show that the percentage of millennials who prefer socialism over capitalism if a full 10 points higher than that of the general population.

 

By comparison, over half of baby boomers polled favor capitalism, compared to 26 percent who support a socialist system.

 

The report also found that one in five Americans in their 20s consider former Soviet dictator Joseph Stalin a hero, despite his genocide of Ukrainians and Orthodox priests. Over a quarter of millennials polled also thought the same for Vladimir Lenin and Kim Jong Un.

 

One of the most troubling findings of the report is that over 40 percent of Americans believe that there should be restrictions placed on the First Amendment and free speech to ensure that anything being said is not “offensive.”

The survey also uncovered that a basic working knowledge of communism among all Americans is lacking.

Seven out of 10 Americans do not know the definition of communism as it is most often confused with socialism. The same amount also underestimates the number of people who have been killed by communist regimes.

"This troubling turn highlights widespread historical illiteracy in American society regarding socialism and the systemic failure of our education system to teach students about the genocide, destruction, and misery caused by communism since the Bolshevik Revolution one hundred years ago,” Smith said.

 

 

Eh, Fox News. Bleh. 

[Ace Nova]

7 hours ago, Chris 55 said:

Eh, Fox News. Bleh. 

[DieselDaisy]

10 hours ago, Georgy Zhukov said:

I've always heard about how Communism didn't work, but for a time it did. Before 1917, Russia was a nation of millions of illiterate peasants with the average life expectancy of between of 30. By Stalin's death they were a nation of engineers, scientists, industry, the population doubled. This crash modernization came at a cost but it was a huge step up from what it was before. Party corruption brought the Soviet Union down. It devolved into a plutocracy. Yeltsin's economic reforms were radical and they did not help with the situations. Yeltsin today is probably the most despised Russian leader other than Gorbachev. Stalin is actually one of the most beloved. Stalin and Peter the Great. He is despised in Poland and Ukraine though. 

 

Under Stalin, despite the tragedies, the people prospered. Russians who lived through the 90's depression remember fondly of the old days and those who grew up in the 90's wish to see those days again and they believe Putin is the man to do it. Putin is by far the most powerful Russian leader since Stalin. He is the richest man in the world, though his salary is modest. He makes even less than the US President. But he steals money from the Russian people and oligarchs alike. 

Some tragedies! Between six-nine million tragedies is the best guess!