The "New Album" Thread. Thanks to the long ass thread, I’m going home!

[ChrisW]

Duff was in no shape to get into yet-another argument about this stuff.  He just went along with the one in charge.

But the others actually played a song which was later used for a solo album?  That's not something we've heard about for the last few decades.

[vloors]

1 hour ago, janrichmond said:

At the time, Duff agreed with Axl about Snakepit songs, Slash wrote it in his book and Duff wrote that in his book too. I'm glad that Axl refused the songs because I love It's 5O'Clock Somewhere.

While I do like 5 clock I feel the best songs plus the other rejected slash tracks at the time (including this I love) would have been a great followup GNR album.

 

43 minutes ago, ChrisW said:

Duff was in no shape to get into yet-another argument about this stuff.  He just went along with the one in charge.

But the others actually played a song which was later used for a solo album?  That's not something we've heard about for the last few decades.

Its on youtube Australian media coverage showed them soundcheck it. Its been posted before.

[2020_Intensions]

9 hours ago, SoulMonster said:

From Axl and Matt it seems more like what Axl had an issue with was that Slash didn't want the songs to be worked on, he brought them in complete and just wanted Axl to add vocals, while Axl wanted to work on them more, at least some of them, probably he thought they could get even better. And then Slash went and recorded them for Snakepit instead. 

 

Just shut up and sing

[Free Bird]

5 hours ago, janrichmond said:

At the time, Duff agreed with Axl about Snakepit songs, Slash wrote it in his book and Duff wrote that in his book too. I'm glad that Axl refused the songs because I love It's 5O'Clock Somewhere.

Imagine hearing the final song in 2008 for the first time, butchered with one million layers and guitars by Bucket, Bumble and Finck. 
After knowing that this would have been the most likely outcome I’m happy as well that Slash just released this album by himself.

[SoulMonster]

6 hours ago, evilfacelessturtle said:

I don't buy that at all. Slash has always worked on his songs collaboratively. He had no problem doing it on AFD and UYI, why would he suddenly change course in 1994, but then let Eric Dover write lyrics and Duff and Gilby co-write on 5 O Clock Somewhere?

I could believe that Slash didn't want to spend forever re-writing the same song over and over again, but from what we've seen with the early CD demos, Axl wasn't actually re-writing the songs constantly. In fact, they hardly changed at all beyond adding layers and fucking about with production.

It's word against word, I suppose. Here's Slash talking about how the songs were rejected because Axl didn't like them or thought they weren't the right style for the next album: (18) 18. NOVEMBER 1993-NOVEMBER 1994: AXL AND SLASH DISAGREES; GILBY IS DISMISSED (a-4-d.com)

And here's Axl and others saying that wasn't really the case but rather that Slash didn't want Axl to make any changes but just "shut up and sing": (18) 18. NOVEMBER 1993-NOVEMBER 1994: AXL AND SLASH DISAGREES; GILBY IS DISMISSED (a-4-d.com) 

[SoulMonster]

1 hour ago, 2020_Intensions said:

Just shut up and sing

Yeah, that's the claim. If true, it would have been different to when they wrote Use Your Illusion. Back then band members also brought in songs, like Slash brought in Coma and Locomotive, but the songs would still be worked on by the entire band and Slash respected Axl's role as singer to come up with lyrics and vocal melodies. According to Axl et al, that was not the case in 1994, the claim is that Slash basically came in with a complete album and that Axl and others just had to play/sing what was written.

I don't know what the truth is, but regardless of that, this spat clearly indicate how bad the relationship was between Slash and Axl at the time, which was the real issue. If they had been friends and able to talk eye to eye, I am sure they would have found a way, a compromise. As it was, Slash couldn't accept taking time on it and simply went and recorded the songs for Snakepit, something Axl would later say he disliked because there was potential in some of the songs and he would have liked to work on them for GN'R. 

As for the "chasing trends" argument: I don't think there is any doubt that Axl wanted to "modernize" GN'R (and I suppose CD was evidence of that, too) and that par of the reason he insulted Slash by not being enthusiastic over the songs Slash brought in, still, Axl would argue that he relinquished and that the band worked on "Appetite-sounding" material in 1995/1996 - material which was then presumably shelved when Slash left.

[ChrisW]

Had Eric Dover already written the lyrics Axl was supposed to "just sing"?  Because it's more likely Slash actually said 'just get to work' and Axl doesn't do that.  Axl also doesn't take responsibility for his refusal to work.  Axl is also surrounded by sycophants so he never hears anything bad about himself, it's always someone else's fault.

If Axl was *genuinely* having so many problems that he couldn't write lyrics, then "just sing" would have been a quick and easy way to keep G'n'R working on their new album with little effort on his end.  But then he wouldn't be in charge, so he has to forbid that option.

[ChrisW]

Freddie Mercury was busy dying and he just sang what he was told to so Queen would have more material to work with.  Axl could have died 20 years ago and had probably already done all the vocals on the released tracks since then.  It's so easy, so fuckin easy...

[Tom2112]

16 hours ago, Free Bird said:

Axl rejected these songs, all of them. After Slash had his record done Axl suddenly wanted to use some of them. There was no “running away”.

According to Axl and Duff they wanted to work on them as they didn't think they were good enough as they were. And listening to Snakepit I definitely agree that some other input would have gone far 

[Tom2112]

8 hours ago, SoulMonster said:

Yeah, that's the claim. If true, it would have been different to when they wrote Use Your Illusion. Back then band members also brought in songs, like Slash brought in Coma and Locomotive, but the songs would still be worked on by the entire band and Slash respected Axl's role as singer to come up with lyrics and vocal melodies. According to Axl et al, that was not the case in 1994, the claim is that Slash basically came in with a complete album and that Axl and others just had to play/sing what was written.

I don't know what the truth is, but regardless of that, this spat clearly indicate how bad the relationship was between Slash and Axl at the time, which was the real issue. If they had been friends and able to talk eye to eye, I am sure they would have found a way, a compromise. As it was, Slash couldn't accept taking time on it and simply went and recorded the songs for Snakepit, something Axl would later say he disliked because there was potential in some of the songs and he would have liked to work on them for GN'R. 

As for the "chasing trends" argument: I don't think there is any doubt that Axl wanted to "modernize" GN'R (and I suppose CD was evidence of that, too) and that par of the reason he insulted Slash by not being enthusiastic over the songs Slash brought in, still, Axl would argue that he relinquished and that the band worked on "Appetite-sounding" material in 1995/1996 - material which was then presumably shelved when Slash left.

Hopefully now that they are older they can get their shit together. In their 30s control was so important, now they should be a bit less concerned especially considering there's now very little money from records 

[axlvai]

1 minute ago, Tom2112 said:

Hopefully now that they are older they can get their shit together. In their 30s control was so important, now they should be a bit less concerned especially considering there's now very little money from records 

This.

Its on Axl. Like always. 

[SoulMonster]

10 minutes ago, Tom2112 said:

Hopefully now that they are older they can get their shit together. In their 30s control was so important, now they should be a bit less concerned especially considering there's now very little money from records 

Yeah. And hopefully they communicate more directly now, instead of through managers and others (which was really Axl's fault back in the 90s).

[Free Bird]

1 hour ago, Tom2112 said:

According to Axl and Duff they wanted to work on them as they didn't think they were good enough as they were. And listening to Snakepit I definitely agree that some other input would have gone far 

It really depends on who you believe. The Axl story doesn’t make any sense to me and tbh I can’t remember what Duff had to say to this topic other than he agreed with Axl that it was to southern rock sounding material. 
I think that record is awesome as it is. Of course, with the right input you could improve it, but that depends strongly on the input. The direction Axl took with CD definitely wouldn’t fit.

Edited June 28 by Free Bird

[ShadowOfTheWave]

Perhaps the real issue with the Snakepit material was Slash presenting a full albums worth of material, which left Axl feeling there was no room for his songs. After all, Slash did publicly say he didn't want to do any more ballads in 1995. In 1996 Slash/Duff/Matt did kind of the same thing once again where they said they had a full album of instrumentals done, all rock songs around 4 minutes with Duff emphasizing no ballads.

There needs to be compromise in a band with members going in different creative directions. Slash could have bargained for having half an album with classic GNR rock songs (after all, Axl said he loved what Slash was writing in 1996, it was the bluesiest stuff since Aerosmith's Rocks), but allowing Axl to have the other half for his ballads and industrial experimentation.

Edited June 28 by ShadowOfTheWave

[Appetitefordiscussion]

18 hours ago, ShadowOfTheWave said:

According to Axl it's Slash who refused to let Fall To Pieces be a GNR song, Slash denies it was ever presented to GNR and insists that it was written in the early 2000s. We certainly have no reason to believe a fully written Anastasia was ever presented to Axl. As for Beggars, it's possible that was one of the songs Axl felt was too "southern rock" (Duff agreed with him apparently), but who knows maybe it was one of the 3 he wanted back.

“According to Axl”. 
 

Would love to read up on this if you have a link to anything legit! 

[Sweersa]

28 minutes ago, ShadowOfTheWave said:

There needs to be compromise in a band with members going in different creative directions. Slash could have bargained for having half an album with classic GNR rock songs (after all, Axl said he loved what Slash was writing in 1996, it was the bluesiest stuff since Aerosmith's Rocks), but allowing Axl to have the other half for his ballads and industrial experimentation.

I couldn't agree more. That's is what I believe most reasonable people would do, plus, it would be overall pleasing to the fans as I'm sure some like both or multiple styles, and other just one. (For example)

It will be interesting to see what form an eventual new album takes. 

[Spoon87]

1 hour ago, Sweersa said:

 

It will be interesting to see what form an eventual new album takes. 

Imaginary.

[ChrisW]

1 hour ago, ShadowOfTheWave said:

After all, Slash did publicly say he didn't want to do any more ballads in 1995. In 1996 Slash/Duff/Matt did kind of the same thing once again where they said they had a full album of instrumentals done, all rock songs around 4 minutes with Duff emphasizing no ballads.

And Axl has to go with the majority vote because they aren't his "employees".

[meadsoap]

12 hours ago, SoulMonster said:

It's word against word, I suppose. Here's Slash talking about how the songs were rejected because Axl didn't like them or thought they weren't the right style for the next album: (18) 18. NOVEMBER 1993-NOVEMBER 1994: AXL AND SLASH DISAGREES; GILBY IS DISMISSED (a-4-d.com)

And here's Axl and others saying that wasn't really the case but rather that Slash didn't want Axl to make any changes but just "shut up and sing": (18) 18. NOVEMBER 1993-NOVEMBER 1994: AXL AND SLASH DISAGREES; GILBY IS DISMISSED (a-4-d.com) 

Besides the people in the linked segment, Marc Canter talked about it a bit too 

https://www.legendaryrockinterviews.com/2012/04/22/legendary-rock-interview-with-guns-n-roses-insider-and-author-marc-canter/)

"I don’t know if Axl heard Izzy’s stuff and thought it to be a little primitive or something but I know that Slash had a good dozen or so as well and Axl was into at least three of them and maybe four but then Slash got big headed and just took them all and said “Fine, I’m gonna go do Snake Pit with them”.  I know that Axl was really upset that Slash quit and that Slash took those particular songs because those were songs that were written explicitly for Guns N’ Roses.  Just because Axl didn’t want all of them didn’t mean he didn’t wanna work with some of them.  I mean, at that point Slash was a little big headed after being out on the road and playing in front of hundreds of thousands of people it starts to go to your head.  It was real similar to Joe Perry leaving Aerosmith and thinking he was going to go somewhere and he went nowhere.  After three records Joe came back."

Edited June 28 by meadsoap

[2020_Intensions]

14 hours ago, SoulMonster said:

Yeah, that's the claim. If true, it would have been different to when they wrote Use Your Illusion. Back then band members also brought in songs, like Slash brought in Coma and Locomotive, but the songs would still be worked on by the entire band and Slash respected Axl's role as singer to come up with lyrics and vocal melodies. According to Axl et al, that was not the case in 1994, the claim is that Slash basically came in with a complete album and that Axl and others just had to play/sing what was written.

I don't know what the truth is, but regardless of that, this spat clearly indicate how bad the relationship was between Slash and Axl at the time, which was the real issue. If they had been friends and able to talk eye to eye, I am sure they would have found a way, a compromise. As it was, Slash couldn't accept taking time on it and simply went and recorded the songs for Snakepit, something Axl would later say he disliked because there was potential in some of the songs and he would have liked to work on them for GN'R. 

As for the "chasing trends" argument: I don't think there is any doubt that Axl wanted to "modernize" GN'R (and I suppose CD was evidence of that, too) and that par of the reason he insulted Slash by not being enthusiastic over the songs Slash brought in, still, Axl would argue that he relinquished and that the band worked on "Appetite-sounding" material in 1995/1996 - material which was then presumably shelved when Slash left.

What gets me is that in 1994 they both appeared in a radio interview very eager and excited about what was coming next for Guns, and mention was made, by Slash, of a "secret project" Axl was working on. Something happened between 1994 & the end of 1995 that ruined any chance of new GnR music and the dissolution of the old lineup. 

[Rindmelon]

2 hours ago, 2020_Intensions said:

What gets me is that in 1994 they both appeared in a radio interview very eager and excited about what was coming next for Guns, and mention was made, by Slash, of a "secret project" Axl was working on. Something happened between 1994 & the end of 1995 that ruined any chance of new GnR music and the dissolution of the old lineup. 

One of the Rockline interviews right? Also the first place Axl mentioned there was intent to work with Brian May.

[DeNfr]

On 6/27/2024 at 10:29 PM, Free Bird said:

Axl rejected these songs, all of them. After Slash had his record done Axl suddenly wanted to use some of them. There was no “running away”.

yeah, that's Slash version, we know.

[Blackstar]

14 hours ago, ChrisW said:

Had Eric Dover already written the lyrics Axl was supposed to "just sing"? 

The timeline of those events is not entirely clear, but most likely the fight about the Snakepit songs that Axl allegedly wanted back took place before Slash found Eric Dover (so when only the instrumental tracks were recorded).

However, it seems that at least some of the songs had at least placeholder lyrics by Slash, and then Eric Dover wrote on them/added to them.  So Slash wanted Axl to just do what Eric Dover eventually did and basically finish the songs in a few days, but Axl didn't want to do that and maybe he really wanted to make more changes. Axl's version of events is probably an exaggerated account from his point of view in which he made the case of Be the Ball with Slash's lyrics, for example to be the case for the whole album.

[Blackstar]

11 hours ago, Appetitefordiscussion said:

“According to Axl”. 
 

Would love to read up on this if you have a link to anything legit! 

https://www.a-4-d.com/t6807-fall-to-pieces

[2020_Intensions]

4 hours ago, Rindmelon said:

One of the Rockline interviews right? Also the first place Axl mentioned there was intent to work with Brian May.

Not sure honestly. It's been a long time since I heard that interview.