Is the record company pissed at Axl? Is that why there is no promotion?

[BaronWalker]

I seriously think the label has heard the final tracks and they are not impressed and are not going to throw a ton of money behind this thing. It's just a complete fucking nightmare.

As much as I hope this is not the truth... It is a valid speculation. As far as the album being a success, I believe it will. (I hope so anyhoo)

My opinion is that Axl knows that he will be judged on this in a big way.. and yes, I think he does not want to fail. So it may be that he is trying not to hype the album as much so that in his eyes, he will not fail. He might have that feeling of "damed if you do and damned if you dont" in regards to releasing the music.

Its all speculation anyway.

[Kaneda]

I'll make it real simple for everyon on here. Answer this one question for me:

Why the lack of promotion?

Simple question. Don't flame me, don't get all hot and bothered. Don't accuse chestnuts of being lazy. Just answer that question. Can you? Now think before you type. If Axl has everything planned out for a big 2006 launch...why no promotion?

Hum.....

[ohmygod]

I'll make it real simple for everyon on here. Answer this one question for me:

Why the lack of promotion?

Simple question. Don't flame me, don't get all hot and bothered. Don't accuse chestnuts of being lazy. Just answer that question. Can you? Now think before you type. If Axl has everything planned out for a big 2006 launch...why no promotion?

Hum.....

no official release date.

keep on humming pal.

[Revolver]

madison why is this guy still here? no really.

Kaneda i'm sure axl and co know what there doing, why do you care so much anyway? as long as you get cd in you're hands, does it really matter.

well, maybe he cares becouse if this album doesn't make it as good as it should they'd maybe not do another one....

but I still think they know what they're doing, and it will be in all magazines, MTV, VH1 and all that, they don't want to lose money just so they could show Axl that they're pissed at him.

[ohyesindeed]

kaneda's point is totally valid:

the more money a label puts into your record, the less likely they are to promote it. as we've all heard, the label has given him over $10 million for chinese, so they're not gonna be that motivated to give him a few million more to promote it, because that's just more debt. i know it has been said that the label stopped giving him money some time ago, and that he's been paying out of pocket. if this is true, axl may also be paying for promotion himself. if the release date is 11/21, i would expect some serious promotion/media attention in the next few weeks. just a little patience.....

as far as this "axl's an artist, not a capitalist" shit is concerned, i think it's moronic. axl is an artist and a capitalist. if he wasn't into money, he wouldnt be touring and making records at the level he is, and he wouldnt live the extravagant lifestyle that he does. if he wasn't an artist, he would suck. axl is a good artist with a lot of money, i would say he's both.

[KBear]

Well it's either Axl has been touring just to make cash and bang models OR the record won't need much promotion. I don't actually remember an ad in a magazine for UYI. But there would be reviews...not many bands hype their album too far in advance...it has to be avialable to buy right? I mean if I see an ad for Audioslave and its not out I think whats the point. Most mags are monthlies. Its always been the press and fans that get bent out of shape about everything, Axl just seems to be laidback about it, almost mystified that anyone really caresa that much. And oh, wasn't Infamous really Warchild? Just a note from the underground.

this isnt just any album though. audioslave and every other band releasing another album have an established fan base. this is a new band, new sound, new album. of course they'll be taking the majority of the old gnr fans with them; but they need to appeal to the newer market if they want commercial success - and considering how many years it has been in the making, just letting it slip by as if it were any other album would be stupid. it deserves the hype and interest around it, this after all is the most anticipated album ever, releasing it descreetly would be a mistake.

Does anyone ever stop to think that W. Axl Rose does not give one blistering fuck about album sales, profit or anything that really has to do with capitalism? I do.

Yeah. The dude only has a mansion and a Ferrari. And designer clothes. Capitalism, schmapitalism.

I can't remember which one, but some magazine named him the #1 artist not motivated by money.

He certainly isn't motivated solely by money. But if you think he doesn't care at all then I think you're wrong. Some of his business dealings proves he cares as well.

Kaneda, your a moron. You know nothing and never will know anything. Not even the difference between your ass and a hole in the ground. Dig your head out of your ass so you can see, clean the shit out of your ears so you can hear and maybe you will realize that Axl is doing this for his hordcore fans that stuck with him, through all the fucking shit.

I don't think real life, the history of this band, bears that out. He's doing this for himself, nobody else.

Look what VR did. They advertised and promoted the fuck out of Contraband. At first it sold great and so did their tours...but when people realized they simply sold out into mainstram rock and the music was good, but nothing close to great, they dropped. Crashed and burned. Thay can't even sell out a show these days.

Proof? I don't really follow VR closely but as far as I know they haven't toured in months. So what do you mean by "these days"? I'm sure when their new album is out they will have little trouble selling out shows.

As for VR's music, if you think that's mainstream rock I don't know what to tell you. Sure they had mainstream success but they aren't even close to the shit that pollutes MTV and Much Music nowadays. Axl's music has always been mainstream too. I mean, what do you call The Blues and Better? That music is pretty accessible. And I don't mean that in a bad way, GN'R's music has always had a certain pop quality to it. It's great as long as it's not an overwhelming quality of the music.

And what's with the arrogance that drips off all your posts? You seem to think you are always right. Trust me, lots of people do not see it that way. Some of your arguments make me go . Like your ridiculous whatever happened to VR thread. You sound like some teenager with a chip on his shoulder.

[Welcome to the Jungle]

They have kinda been promoting the album by going on tour and playing the new songs and using MLB.com to advertise for the tour will get the people interested. people should just relax and go with the flow.

On a side note my dad was listen to i belive its called Zombie Radio on XM i could be mistaken but thats what he told me it was and I heard them also say that CD could be released on the 21st of November and then they played Sweet Child so it was pretty cool.

[KBear]

Does anyone ever stop to think that W. Axl Rose does not give one blistering fuck about album sales, profit or anything that really has to do with capitalism? I do. I can't remember which one, but some magazine named him the #1 artist not motivated by money. Axl doesn't give a shit about what mainstream rock lovers think. It's just him in a band doing what they love, which is making music and touring around the globe. I doubt Axl is the least bit concerned about promoting the album and your to a bunch of dicks that like Bink 182, Hansen, the Moffats and other gay rock acts like sum 41.

Are you serious? You think Axl doesn't care about album sales? He's just a rock n roller in a band and doing what he loves? Ok, perhaps it is not the money but for fucks sake it's taken this long because he CARES TOO MUCH! He hasn't been able to release the fucking thing because he wants everything to be so perfect to the point where it's psychotic. He's determined to put out an album that will launch him to the heights he was at with UYI, he wants that power and fame once again and he's trying desparately to achieve that which has made him look like a fool. He can't fathom the idea of mediocrity or failure. Kaneda is dead on once again, there is something seriously wrong here with the promotion of "the most anticipated rock album in history." The web site is absolutely horrible and there is NOTHING in the way of advertising going on. It's absolutely laughable. I seriously think the label has heard the final tracks and they are not impressed and are not going to throw a ton of money behind this thing. It's just a complete fucking nightmare.

No, actually I think your just as much of an idiot as he is. Thats whats going on here. Axl is a perfectionist, not a capitalist.

A8R

Great rebuttal there. The dude makes a great point and you insult him and then state your opinion as if it's a fact. LOL. Maybe you should read what he posted again, then what madison posted, and then what I posted. But that probably won't change your mind...you'll just think we're all idiots. Oh well, if that's what you need to do.

[ssiscool]

seriously Kaneda do you think you know how GNR works.

[Allen8R]

Well it's either Axl has been touring just to make cash and bang models OR the record won't need much promotion. I don't actually remember an ad in a magazine for UYI. But there would be reviews...not many bands hype their album too far in advance...it has to be avialable to buy right? I mean if I see an ad for Audioslave and its not out I think whats the point. Most mags are monthlies. Its always been the press and fans that get bent out of shape about everything, Axl just seems to be laidback about it, almost mystified that anyone really caresa that much. And oh, wasn't Infamous really Warchild? Just a note from the underground.

this isnt just any album though. audioslave and every other band releasing another album have an established fan base. this is a new band, new sound, new album. of course they'll be taking the majority of the old gnr fans with them; but they need to appeal to the newer market if they want commercial success - and considering how many years it has been in the making, just letting it slip by as if it were any other album would be stupid. it deserves the hype and interest around it, this after all is the most anticipated album ever, releasing it descreetly would be a mistake.

Does anyone ever stop to think that W. Axl Rose does not give one blistering fuck about album sales, profit or anything that really has to do with capitalism? I do.

Yeah. The dude only has a mansion and a Ferrari. And designer clothes. Capitalism, schmapitalism.

I can't remember which one, but some magazine named him the #1 artist not motivated by money.

He certainly isn't motivated solely by money. But if you think he doesn't care at all then I think you're wrong. Some of his business dealings proves he cares as well.

Kaneda, your a moron. You know nothing and never will know anything. Not even the difference between your ass and a hole in the ground. Dig your head out of your ass so you can see, clean the shit out of your ears so you can hear and maybe you will realize that Axl is doing this for his hordcore fans that stuck with him, through all the fucking shit.

I don't think real life, the history of this band, bears that out. He's doing this for himself, nobody else.

Look what VR did. They advertised and promoted the fuck out of Contraband. At first it sold great and so did their tours...but when people realized they simply sold out into mainstram rock and the music was good, but nothing close to great, they dropped. Crashed and burned. Thay can't even sell out a show these days.

Proof? I don't really follow VR closely but as far as I know they haven't toured in months. So what do you mean by "these days"? I'm sure when their new album is out they will have little trouble selling out shows.

As for VR's music, if you think that's mainstream rock I don't know what to tell you. Sure they had mainstream success but they aren't even close to the shit that pollutes MTV and Much Music nowadays. Axl's music has always been mainstream too. I mean, what do you call The Blues and Better? That music is pretty accessible. And I don't mean that in a bad way, GN'R's music has always had a certain pop quality to it. It's great as long as it's not an overwhelming quality of the music.

And what's with the arrogance that drips off all your posts? You seem to think you are always right. Trust me, lots of people do not see it that way. Some of your arguments make me go . Like your ridiculous whatever happened to VR thread. You sound like some teenager with a chip on his shoulder.

VR didn't tour this year, i think they played 5 shows that were not sold out...apparently by afar.

As fr my "whatever happend to VR threat", that got spun out of proportion, by alot of angr VR fans. If you go and look at it it's 6 pages of nothing to do with what VR is up to these days.

And as for arrogance, i'll admitt openly that I have a strong opinion and I stick to it, but olny because it's based on something that is conctrete. I do respond to threads like this with what seems to be arrogance, but if you read through kaneda's posts you will find more flip flops and hypocracy and bullshit that most US elections. Thats why It seems arrogant to you.

As for Axl being motivated by money to a CERTAIN DEGREE, yes of course he is. If you made millions doing what you oved doing would you live in a Log Cabin or a Van Down By The River??? I didnt think so. It would be nice to have lots of money but that is still not what motivates Axl. You can twist what I say, misenterpret what I say all you want. You would have to do that in order to picture me as a teenager with a chip out of shoulder by simply reading a GNR forum. Although, I am more of a small town white boy trying to make ends meet. hahaha.

So kbear, it looks like you will have to read what I say a lttle bit closer and look past the satiricle humore and cockyness, but also get used to it. Hypocrits beware, ALLEN8R is here.

A8R

[Kollemann99]

I think the GNR managment makes a good job

[KBear]

Well it's either Axl has been touring just to make cash and bang models OR the record won't need much promotion. I don't actually remember an ad in a magazine for UYI. But there would be reviews...not many bands hype their album too far in advance...it has to be avialable to buy right? I mean if I see an ad for Audioslave and its not out I think whats the point. Most mags are monthlies. Its always been the press and fans that get bent out of shape about everything, Axl just seems to be laidback about it, almost mystified that anyone really caresa that much. And oh, wasn't Infamous really Warchild? Just a note from the underground.

this isnt just any album though. audioslave and every other band releasing another album have an established fan base. this is a new band, new sound, new album. of course they'll be taking the majority of the old gnr fans with them; but they need to appeal to the newer market if they want commercial success - and considering how many years it has been in the making, just letting it slip by as if it were any other album would be stupid. it deserves the hype and interest around it, this after all is the most anticipated album ever, releasing it descreetly would be a mistake.

Does anyone ever stop to think that W. Axl Rose does not give one blistering fuck about album sales, profit or anything that really has to do with capitalism? I do.

Yeah. The dude only has a mansion and a Ferrari. And designer clothes. Capitalism, schmapitalism.

I can't remember which one, but some magazine named him the #1 artist not motivated by money.

He certainly isn't motivated solely by money. But if you think he doesn't care at all then I think you're wrong. Some of his business dealings proves he cares as well.

Kaneda, your a moron. You know nothing and never will know anything. Not even the difference between your ass and a hole in the ground. Dig your head out of your ass so you can see, clean the shit out of your ears so you can hear and maybe you will realize that Axl is doing this for his hordcore fans that stuck with him, through all the fucking shit.

I don't think real life, the history of this band, bears that out. He's doing this for himself, nobody else.

Look what VR did. They advertised and promoted the fuck out of Contraband. At first it sold great and so did their tours...but when people realized they simply sold out into mainstram rock and the music was good, but nothing close to great, they dropped. Crashed and burned. Thay can't even sell out a show these days.

Proof? I don't really follow VR closely but as far as I know they haven't toured in months. So what do you mean by "these days"? I'm sure when their new album is out they will have little trouble selling out shows.

As for VR's music, if you think that's mainstream rock I don't know what to tell you. Sure they had mainstream success but they aren't even close to the shit that pollutes MTV and Much Music nowadays. Axl's music has always been mainstream too. I mean, what do you call The Blues and Better? That music is pretty accessible. And I don't mean that in a bad way, GN'R's music has always had a certain pop quality to it. It's great as long as it's not an overwhelming quality of the music.

And what's with the arrogance that drips off all your posts? You seem to think you are always right. Trust me, lots of people do not see it that way. Some of your arguments make me go . Like your ridiculous whatever happened to VR thread. You sound like some teenager with a chip on his shoulder.

VR didn't tour this year, i think they played 5 shows that were not sold out...apparently by afar.

As fr my "whatever happend to VR threat", that got spun out of proportion, by alot of angr VR fans. If you go and look at it it's 6 pages of nothing to do with what VR is up to these days.

And as for arrogance, i'll admitt openly that I have a strong opinion and I stick to it, but olny because it's based on something that is conctrete. I do respond to threads like this with what seems to be arrogance, but if you read through kaneda's posts you will find more flip flops and hypocracy and bullshit that most US elections. Thats why It seems arrogant to you.

As for Axl being motivated by money to a CERTAIN DEGREE, yes of course he is. If you made millions doing what you oved doing would you live in a Log Cabin or a Van Down By The River??? I didnt think so. It would be nice to have lots of money but that is still not what motivates Axl. You can twist what I say, misenterpret what I say all you want. You would have to do that in order to picture me as a teenager with a chip out of shoulder by simply reading a GNR forum. Although, I am more of a small town white boy trying to make ends meet. hahaha.

So kbear, it looks like you will have to read what I say a lttle bit closer and look past the satiricle humore and cockyness, but also get used to it. Hypocrits beware, ALLEN8R is here.

A8R

I expected you to flame me but I gotta give you credit for a pretty cool reply.

You have to put the VR shows into some context. You can only get so much mileage out of one album, and any objective thinker should realize that they got lots out of Contraband. But it's time to move on from that and onto the next project. We will see what they offer us probably within a few months.

I don't agree with your thread though. There is no need to ask whatever happened to VR. Contraband came out only two years ago. They toured off of it for a year. Had plenty of success. Of course they are going to withdraw from the limelight while they prepare their follow up. They haven't been gone for very long; one year out of the spotlight between albums is not abnormal. And there is enough VR news out there if you look for it. But that's enough about VR.

As for Axl, there is enough evidence that he is a capitalist and wants money and popularity. There is nothing wrong with that. His focus on that doesn't detract from his focus on music. I think he strikes a pretty good balance and yeah, if it came down to it I think Axl would not compromise his music and his vision in order to sell records. I totally respect him for that. Slash is the same way. He does more commercial stuff perhaps, but musically he does what he loves (bluesy rock) whether it's in or not. Getting Scott and the new sound they have is updating an old sound for today...Axl is doing the same using Finck's background in industrial, not to mention various new sounds in the new songs. Pop stars are fucking sellouts, not Axl or Slash.

Edited October 9, 2006 by KBear

[Allen8R]

Well it's either Axl has been touring just to make cash and bang models OR the record won't need much promotion. I don't actually remember an ad in a magazine for UYI. But there would be reviews...not many bands hype their album too far in advance...it has to be avialable to buy right? I mean if I see an ad for Audioslave and its not out I think whats the point. Most mags are monthlies. Its always been the press and fans that get bent out of shape about everything, Axl just seems to be laidback about it, almost mystified that anyone really caresa that much. And oh, wasn't Infamous really Warchild? Just a note from the underground.

this isnt just any album though. audioslave and every other band releasing another album have an established fan base. this is a new band, new sound, new album. of course they'll be taking the majority of the old gnr fans with them; but they need to appeal to the newer market if they want commercial success - and considering how many years it has been in the making, just letting it slip by as if it were any other album would be stupid. it deserves the hype and interest around it, this after all is the most anticipated album ever, releasing it descreetly would be a mistake.

Does anyone ever stop to think that W. Axl Rose does not give one blistering fuck about album sales, profit or anything that really has to do with capitalism? I do.

Yeah. The dude only has a mansion and a Ferrari. And designer clothes. Capitalism, schmapitalism.

I can't remember which one, but some magazine named him the #1 artist not motivated by money.

He certainly isn't motivated solely by money. But if you think he doesn't care at all then I think you're wrong. Some of his business dealings proves he cares as well.

Kaneda, your a moron. You know nothing and never will know anything. Not even the difference between your ass and a hole in the ground. Dig your head out of your ass so you can see, clean the shit out of your ears so you can hear and maybe you will realize that Axl is doing this for his hordcore fans that stuck with him, through all the fucking shit.

I don't think real life, the history of this band, bears that out. He's doing this for himself, nobody else.

Look what VR did. They advertised and promoted the fuck out of Contraband. At first it sold great and so did their tours...but when people realized they simply sold out into mainstram rock and the music was good, but nothing close to great, they dropped. Crashed and burned. Thay can't even sell out a show these days.

Proof? I don't really follow VR closely but as far as I know they haven't toured in months. So what do you mean by "these days"? I'm sure when their new album is out they will have little trouble selling out shows.

As for VR's music, if you think that's mainstream rock I don't know what to tell you. Sure they had mainstream success but they aren't even close to the shit that pollutes MTV and Much Music nowadays. Axl's music has always been mainstream too. I mean, what do you call The Blues and Better? That music is pretty accessible. And I don't mean that in a bad way, GN'R's music has always had a certain pop quality to it. It's great as long as it's not an overwhelming quality of the music.

And what's with the arrogance that drips off all your posts? You seem to think you are always right. Trust me, lots of people do not see it that way. Some of your arguments make me go . Like your ridiculous whatever happened to VR thread. You sound like some teenager with a chip on his shoulder.

VR didn't tour this year, i think they played 5 shows that were not sold out...apparently by afar.

As fr my "whatever happend to VR threat", that got spun out of proportion, by alot of angr VR fans. If you go and look at it it's 6 pages of nothing to do with what VR is up to these days.

And as for arrogance, i'll admitt openly that I have a strong opinion and I stick to it, but olny because it's based on something that is conctrete. I do respond to threads like this with what seems to be arrogance, but if you read through kaneda's posts you will find more flip flops and hypocracy and bullshit that most US elections. Thats why It seems arrogant to you.

As for Axl being motivated by money to a CERTAIN DEGREE, yes of course he is. If you made millions doing what you oved doing would you live in a Log Cabin or a Van Down By The River??? I didnt think so. It would be nice to have lots of money but that is still not what motivates Axl. You can twist what I say, misenterpret what I say all you want. You would have to do that in order to picture me as a teenager with a chip out of shoulder by simply reading a GNR forum. Although, I am more of a small town white boy trying to make ends meet. hahaha.

So kbear, it looks like you will have to read what I say a lttle bit closer and look past the satiricle humore and cockyness, but also get used to it. Hypocrits beware, ALLEN8R is here.

A8R

I expected you to flame me but I gotta give you credit for a pretty cool reply.

You have to put the VR shows into some context. You can only get so much mileage out of one album, and any objective thinker should realize that they got lots out of Contraband. But it's time to move on from that and onto the next project. We will see what they offer us probably within a few months.

I don't agree with your thread though. There is no need to ask whatever happened to VR. Contraband came out only two years ago. They toured off of it for a year. Had plenty of success. Of course they are going to withdraw from the limelight while they prepare their follow up. They haven't been gone for very long; one year out of the spotlight between albums is not abnormal. And there is enough VR news out there if you look for it. But that's enough about VR.

As for Axl, there is enough evidence that he is a capitalist and wants money and popularity. There is nothing wrong with that. His focus on that doesn't detract from his focus on music. I think he strikes a pretty good balance and yeah, if it came down to it I think Axl would not compromise his music and his vision in order to sell records. I totally respect him for that. Slash is the same way. He does more commercial stuff perhaps, but musically he does what he loves (bluesy rock) whether it's in or not. Getting Scott and the new sound they have is updating an old sound for today...Axl is doing the same using Finck's background in industrial, not to mention various new sounds in the new songs. Pop stars are fucking sellouts, not Axl or Slash.

I think we're getting into a new thread discussion here now, but thats allright.

I think it's very hard to say Axl is more focused on capitalist gain (profit) when he has dumped over 13 million into it and pays people to play on it.

A8R

[Guest Matt13]

Gunners,

Let's say November 21 is the release date...that's just a little over a month away and still there is ZERO real promotion going on for Chinese Democracy. No add buys have been placed in any magazines, no video is on MTV, no single is on the airways, no banners up in Times Square, no magazine has even heard finished tracks, nothing.

Since the album HAS to come out in 2006 since so many camps have said it will, Axl included, this can only mean one thing. That the record company will make this a soft launch and won't but tons of money behind it. Considering all of the money Geffen/Interscope has given Axl over the past 15 years, it's likely that they are pissed at how many years he has dicked them over and thus, this album will have to promote itself, supported only by the tour.

While there's no doubt that the album, the tour, and the media frenzy around the album will garner lots of exposure to the band, I for one am very disappointed that we haven't gotten the sort of promotion or hype we deserve for this legendary band.

I think their new website showed all of us that corners are being cut, that a lot of cheap alternatives are being taken. It's sort of sad that I have friends in garage bands that have a nicer website that the official Guns N Roses website.

Everyday I walk to work in New York City, the media capital of the world, and I see posters and adds for tons of albums coming out this November. But nothing on Chinese D. Shouldn't buzz be building the moment the release date is set? And you have to set a release date at least a month before launch...this whole 11th hour thing is so backwards. Why the cryptic statement in the press release about 13 tuesdays between now and the end of the year?

I just hope the album promotion picks up VERY SOON, or else Axl could be in for a rude awakening when album sales numbers roll in.

He's got A LOT more competition today when it comes to moving records, and everyone else is playing the game right. Axl needs to deliver a statement asap and the promotion needs to begin now. And don't tell me that this tour is promotion, it's not. They've toured before and nothing happened, so people don't care as much about a tour, they want an album.

This BY FAR has got to be one of the stupidest Kaneda posts of all time. Dude, you're REALLY reaching for attention now.

The bottom line here is this: the record company would never do anything to take away from its own bottom line. It's not about personal vendettas, it's about $$$.

Dumb, dumb, dumb post. This one, by leaps and bounds, takes the cake.

Other than that...

the record keeps on skipping....

[Funeral]

a well known band like GNR don't need a heavy promotion....Just a single and a Video airplay will do the trick!

Look at Aerosmith for example. They got a record coming out and there's a zero promotion!

[Zeppelin]

For a person who claims to be involved in marketing/promotion, this is the quintessential retard post by you Kaneda.

This isn't a little kid who won't give his marbles back to spite the crying kid in the schoolyard. This is serious business, whether the promotion is big or not.

[Tyson]

Regardless of all the bitching that is taking place, one fact remains evident: there needs to be a killer single, release date and hardcore promotion for both the tour and album. That fact that there hasn't even been a release date for an album that is supposedly coming out this year is somewhat worrisome for me, if only because I want Axl to be given the best possible chance to wage a successful comeback.

[KBear]

I usually don't mind Kaneda threads, but I gotta agree that the record company will care about making money first. There are cases where business becomes personal and not about the money (you'd be surprised) but it would be a stretch to think it's happening here.

However, I think it's possible that the record company might be making a calculated move. The album will get lots of attention even if the marketing campaign is relatively small. Given that they've already sunk so much money into the album they may believe the way to maximize profits is to not spend a lot on marketing for an album that may not need it. I can actually see a lot of logic in that, though of course there is also a risk. But sometimes business is all about taking risks. This isn't even a major one. The album will achieve a minimum number of sales with zero promotion - whether it's 1 million copies, or 2 million, or 5 million, whatever. Then they've got the tour as well that'll bring in lots of cash. This might even be less risky than dropping another $3-5 million (or whatever it costs) on a promotional campaign and then having to recoup even more money. I'm sure they've already run all their scenario calculations and they've made a decision based on the results.

I gotta say, it would be so cool if this album would be a huge success with next to no actual promotion. It's not like that would be a first though...AFD for example probably got little promotion when it became a huge success. But it would be a bit of a revolutionary approach for an album that is such a highly anticipated release.

Edited October 9, 2006 by KBear

[The Sandman]

That makes no sense, they have the most to lose...

[NEU-YORK]

no way the record company would cut their own nose off to spite their face.

but at the same time, it is mind boggling as to what is really going on, come on like if the album is coming out somthing just HAS to happen soon.... in the next two weeks!

[milkboy]

I brought this issue up a few weeks back suggesting that the existing riff between Geffen and GNR camp could spell problems when releasing the album. Few agreed and the consensus was that there was no way Geffen would stand in the way of Chinese Democracy's release because record companies are greedy machines that only care about making money.

I found few to agree with me, but I still think record companies are run by people. People hold grudges and there has been and continues to be a big disconnect between the label and the band. That is why there is no promotion.

[Naupis]

I think it's very hard to say Axl is more focused on capitalist gain (profit) when he has dumped over 13 million into it and pays people to play on it.

The only reason he has pumped so much into it is because he is living off the old GNR contract they signed when they were the biggest band in the world. The advance for the record was probably tremendous, and there is not much the label can do about it as they were on the hook for the money one way or the other. At least this way they might get a chance to make some of it back.

To say Axl Rose is not capitalistic is the most absurd thing ever said on this board. I think he knew in the early 90's he wanted his own band, and in the process pulled a series of power plays to secure the name for future use. You don't think he saw the monetary value of the name back then? Of course that drove everything he did. A label was never going to give Axl Rose 13 million dollars to record his dream album, but they would give it to Guns N' Roses. Axl Rose doesn't headline major Festivals, but GNR does.

Everything he has done for 15 years now has been driven by the financial and commercial advantages the name provides. If he wasn't by commercial success or exposure he would not be operating in the manner he is today. This has nothing to do with artistic integrity, otherwise he would not have re-recorded the material multiple times the past few years to try and make it seem more current. If he didn't care, he would release what he thought was good music regardless of what was in at the time. Not to mention there are more than a few artists/people that would argue that he exactly zero artistic integrity given that he is more than willing to get up and play more than half a setlist every night that was written by an entirely different set of musicians and still pass it off as GNR.

Axl Rose is alot of things, but unaffected by money and fame is not one of them.

[Guest Matt13]

I usually don't mind Kaneda threads, but I gotta agree that the record company will care about making money first. There are cases where business becomes personal and not about the money (you'd be surprised) but it would be a stretch to think it's happening here.

However, I think it's possible that the record company might be making a calculated move. The album will get lots of attention even if the marketing campaign is relatively small. Given that they've already sunk so much money into the album they may believe the way to maximize profits is to not spend a lot on marketing for an album that may not need it. I can actually see a lot of logic in that, though of course there is also a risk. But sometimes business is all about taking risks. This isn't even a major one. The album will achieve a minimum number of sales with zero promotion - whether it's 1 million copies, or 2 million, or 5 million, whatever. Then they've got the tour as well that'll bring in lots of cash. This might even be less risky than dropping another $3-5 million (or whatever it costs) on a promotional campaign and then having to recoup even more money. I'm sure they've already run all their scenario calculations and they've made a decision based on the results.

I gotta say, it would be so cool if this album would be a huge success with next to no actual promotion. It's not like that would be a first though...AFD for example probably got little promotion when it became a huge success. But it would be a bit of a revolutionary approach for an album that is such a highly anticipated release.

I'm with ya KBear. Say there's no promotion at all, aside from this MLB stuff and the tour. If this GNR record has these 'big guns' that we keep hearing about... and the stuff we have heard will be very popular (I for one thing TWAT and CITR have HUGE potential), all it will take is a little airplay on the radio to get people to buy the album in droves. AFD, as you pointed out, had ZERO promotion. I even read that getting the WTTJ video on MTV was a favor somebody at the network owed a Geffen exec... after that video aired, GNR took off... they really launched into orbit with SCOM... well over a year after AFD was even released. That album has gone on to be one of the greatest selling albums of all time.

So, even if CD is remotely revolutionary, it will sell just fine and be a huge commercial success without any promotion... much less MLB or the tour.

I would bank on a single in the next couple of weeks though, only makes sense... especially since all of the dates on the tour aren't even close to being sold out... from what I understand. Would I be surprised if there wasn't a single?

Not at all.

And Kaneda, your post, again, was not very well thought out and just another example of you trying to get attention. Stop shooting yourself in the foot.

[Takeshi]

I found few to agree with me, but I still think record companies are run by people. People hold grudges and there has been and continues to be a big disconnect between the label and the band. That is why there is no promotion.

These people who run the record companies also know that they are judged by how much the company earns. If they don't bring in enough profit, they're gone. Given the current economic climate for record companies, they cannot afford to play games with the promotion of a new product.

[Guest Matt13]

I think it's very hard to say Axl is more focused on capitalist gain (profit) when he has dumped over 13 million into it and pays people to play on it.

The only reason he has pumped so much into it is because he is living off the old GNR contract they signed when they were the biggest band in the world. The advance for the record was probably tremendous, and there is not much the label can do about it as they were on the hook for the money one way or the other. At least this way they might get a chance to make some of it back.

To say Axl Rose is not capitalistic is the most absurd thing ever said on this board. I think he knew in the early 90's he wanted his own band, and in the process pulled a series of power plays to secure the name for future use. You don't think he saw the monetary value of the name back then? Of course that drove everything he did. A label was never going to give Axl Rose 13 million dollars to record his dream album, but they would give it to Guns N' Roses. Axl Rose doesn't headline major Festivals, but GNR does.

Everything he has done for 15 years now has been driven by the financial and commercial advantages the name provides. If he wasn't by commercial success or exposure he would not be operating in the manner he is today. This has nothing to do with artistic integrity, otherwise he would not have re-recorded the material multiple times the past few years to try and make it seem more current. If he didn't care, he would release what he thought was good music regardless of what was in at the time. Not to mention there are more than a few artists/people that would argue that he exactly zero artistic integrity given that he is more than willing to get up and play more than half a setlist every night that was written by an entirely different set of musicians and still pass it off as GNR.

Axl Rose is alot of things, but unaffected by money and fame is not one of them.

Very good post... Madison... give this guy the Intelligent Post of the Month award. I never thought about how Axl may have had Geffen by the balls by owning the name 'Guns N' Roses'. You're 100% dead on with that... if they owed the band the advance for a new album, and gave no timetable, they were screwed.

The only thing I would disagree with is the part about Axl having "zero artistic integrity given that he is more than willing to get up and play more than half a setlist every night that was written by an entirely different set of musicians and still pass it off as GNR."

I truly believe 'the old guys' left because they didn't want to evolve with the changing times in music and just kept wanting to put out run-of-the-mill bluesey rock. Slash said over and over that '5 O'Clock Somewhere' was the next GNR album, and Axl didn't want any part of it. Imagine GNR putting out an album like that in the middle of the grunge era. They would have become just another nostalgia band like Motley Crue or Def Leoppard playing state fairs.

Axl wanted to evolve, it was the only way to guarantee GNR to stay in a class with the all time greats at the end of the day (that day is yet to come... I hope). All of your greatest acts of all time evolved... The Beatles and Pink Floyd are two obvious bands that evolved and maintained legendary success. Could you imagine if Floyed kept making music like that from The Piper at the Gates of Dawn or Ummagamma? Please. Pink Floyd who? At the same time, Axl, after finding the right group of guys to fill the part (the 'old guys' left... end of story) it took time to get the wheels rolling again. As evidence in the music we've heard so far, it's not all about 'Axl, Axl, Axl'. The other guys are playing a huge part in the songwriting. I doubt Izzy would have been palling aroud with Axl and playing a few gigs with the band if he thought this was the Axl Rose project, and all about fortune and fame.

I honestly believe Axl wants to give the world great music and a legacy that will be legendary for generations to come. I don't think Axl is trying to live off of the GNR legacy or capitalize on the old material. It does appear that way, but I think they have to and are being forced to by the record company to drum up some popularity again before the release of CD. Once that happens, I think you'll hear an entirely different set list than the one we've been used to since 2002 for the most part.

Playing the 'big guns' before dropping the album would take away from the whole mystery behind the album itself, and quell any excitement that might be building up as we approach the album release.

My two cents.